Media Briefing following Special NEC Meeting

Added: 2026-05-20

[00:00:00]instance draft a new and permanent rule 129i that gives effect to the judgement.

[00:00:11]The rules committee will then consider that draft.

[00:00:16]The house will then adopt it.

[00:00:19]The speaker of the National Assembly the honorable Thoko Didiza will then program the further steps.

[00:00:29]The African National Congress respects the Constitutional Court the Constitutional independence of the speaker.

[00:00:40]And her programming of the work of the house.

[00:00:44]We will participate in every step of that process.

[00:00:48]Fully constructively and with the discipline and dignity that this movement has always brought to work of the people's parliament.

[00:00:59]Allow me to speak to a question that has occupied the press in the days since the judgement was delivered.

[00:01:09]The president of the African National Congress who is also the president of the Republic has like every citizen of our beloved country the right to a fair hearing and the right to seek judicial review where it is available to him.

[00:01:30]The Constitutional Court itself at paragraph 139 of the late judgement expressly preserved the path of review of the independent panel report.

[00:01:47]After receiving and carefully considering the senior council opinion the National Executive Committee have recorded our unanimous support for the president's decision to lodge that review application in the High Court accompanied by any other legal procedures as his lawyers may advise.

[00:02:13]The National Executive Committee has endorsed that approached unanimously.

[00:02:20]I want to be very clear about something on behalf of the ANC.

[00:02:25]The exercise of constitutional rights by a citizen of the Republic of the Republic including a citizen who holds the office of president is not an evasion of accountability.

[00:02:41]It is the substance of accountability.

[00:02:45]Accountability under our constitution is exercised through institutions and through the rights those institutions guarantee.

[00:02:58]To suggest that the president should not exercise the constitutional remedies that the court itself preserved is to suggest that the office of the president strips a person of rights that every other South African enjoys.

[00:03:17]That is not the position of our constitution.

[00:03:21]That is not the position of the African National Congress.

[00:03:26]The movement that helped to write that constitution.

[00:03:31]I now wish to put a matter that the public discourse has been speculating about firmly and finally to rest.

[00:03:41]The National Executive Committee of the African National Congress in the meeting that has just arisen did not consider and was not asked to consider the recall of the president of the African National Congress.

[00:03:57]Resignation was not on the table.

[00:04:00]None of those matters were on the table.

[00:04:04]The National Executive Committee reaffirmed in clear and unambiguous terms that its full and continuing support for the president of the African National Congress Comrade Cyril Ramaphosa as the leader of this movement and in that capacity as the leader of the government of National Unity.

[00:04:28]The president of the African National Congress holds his office on a mandate from the branches of the African National Congress.

[00:04:38]Those branches elected him to a 5-year term at the 55th National Conference at Nasrec in December 2022.

[00:04:49]The next conference of the ANC is in December 2027.

[00:04:55]The mandate of the president from the branches of the ANC is intact.

[00:05:02]We will not, as a movement, allow speculation in the press however energetic to substitute for the constitutional moments of our movement.

[00:05:14]And those constitutional moments are the conferences of the African National Congress the deliberations of the National Working Committee and the considered decisions of the National Executive Committee.

[00:05:29]The president of the African National Congress is also the president of the Republic of South Africa elected by the National Assembly under Section 86 of the Constitution following the May 2024 general election.

[00:05:46]He was elected on the platform of an African National Congress whose voters across every province and community of our country returned the movement to government.

[00:05:58]Though to government in a new form, that of the government of national unity that the African National Congress holds together with our nine partners in the statement of intent of 30th June 2024.

[00:06:15]The president's mandate from the people of South Africa given through the ballots is a mandate to do the work of the state.

[00:06:24]That mandate is intact.

[00:06:27]The president will continue to do the work of the state on behalf of the people who entrusted him with that mandate.

[00:06:36]And so, members of the media and fellow South Africans, the work continues.

[00:06:43]The African National Congress on the 8th day of January 2026 declared this year the year of decisive action to fix local government and transform the economy.

[00:06:58]The work of that declaration continues uninterrupted by the events of this past Friday.

[00:07:06]The branches of the African National Congress have been rebuilt as activist branches across the length and breadth of our country.

[00:07:16]The manifesto consultations are on course.

[00:07:20]The candidate selections are in train.

[00:07:25]The 4th of November 2026 the day on which the people of South Africa will go to the polls in the local government elections is the focus of our movement's daily work.

[00:07:39]The judgment of the Constitutional Court does not interrupt the work of the state.

[00:07:45]The judgment of the Constitutional Court does not interrupt the work of the branches.

[00:07:52]The judgment of the Constitutional Court does not interrupt the work of the government of national unity.

[00:08:00]The parliamentary process that the judgment has activated will run its course.

[00:08:08]The legal process that the president has the right to pursue will run its course.

[00:08:14]Both processes will be conducted with the dignity, the seriousness, and the constitutional fidelity that the people of South Africa expect of their institutions.

[00:08:29]And while those processes run their course, the work of governing and the work of building a better life for all our people will not pause for a single day.

[00:08:42]Allow me to close where I began.

[00:08:46]The example of the honorable Chief Justice Mandisa Maya on Friday the 8th of May, 2026, is the example of South Africa at its best.

[00:08:58]In a difficult matter, our highest court spoke with measured authority.

[00:09:04]Our parliament will in the weeks ahead do its work in the same spirit.

[00:09:11]The president of the republic will continue to do his work in the same spirit.

[00:09:17]The African National Congress, the oldest national liberation movement on the African continent, will continue to do its work in the same spirit.

[00:09:27]Together as a movement, as a government of national unity, as a nation, we will walk through this moment as we have walked through every moment of our young democracy.

[00:09:41]With discipline, with dignity, with humility, and with our eyes fixed on the better future our forebears taught us to imagine.

[00:09:53]Members of the media, fellow South Africans, we stand at a defining moment of our democracy.

[00:10:00]Our people are watching.

[00:10:02]History is calling.

[00:10:05]The future is waiting.

[00:10:07]The ANC will be there to meet them at the Constitutional Court, in the National Assembly, in the government of national unity, and at every branch, in every community of this country we love.

[00:10:22]The system of governance, the state established by the ANC from 1994 is working the way it was designed to work.

[00:10:34]Our democracy, our constitutional democracy, is strong.

[00:10:38]It will remain strong under the ANC.

[00:10:41]Rights will be protected.

[00:10:44]There shall be accountability for all.

[00:10:46]No one is above the law, and no one is under the law. We are equal.

[00:10:54]What is good for one must be good for the other.

[00:10:58]The president's rights with personhood are also contained in the Constitution.

[00:11:05]The ANC wants to make it clear that we are in our renewal and regeneration, people's needs first.

[00:11:13]Economic transformation first.

[00:11:16]No retreat.

[00:11:19]The last matter the African National Congress wish to report is about the Eastern Cape and Gauteng.

[00:11:30]The ANC is functioning well in the Eastern Cape in Gauteng or anywhere else.

[00:11:36]The ANC constitution is designed to respond to human beings, to nature, and realities of life and of politics.

[00:11:45]The National Executive Committee has, in line with the constitution of the ANC, approved the regular the regularization of organizational business in these two provinces through the establishment of provincial task teams in the place of provincial executive committees whose terms have expired without a provincial conference having sat.

[00:12:14]This is the normal course of business of our movement in such circumstances.

[00:12:20]It is exactly what the constitution of the ANC provides for.

[00:12:25]The governments of these provinces are not affected by these organizational matters of the movement.

[00:12:32]The work of the state continues.

[00:12:34]The National Working Committee will on Monday consider the compositions of the two provincial task teams.

[00:12:43]So, Gauteng [snorts] provincial task team, its term has expired and it will be reconstituted and it was in the process of evaluation uh to meet the constitutional requirements like KZN.

[00:13:02]Uh that we have done there in terms of the PTT and that will happen this Monday and will be announced to the two provinces in the due course of the week.

[00:13:15]The Eastern Cape is not disbanded. Its term lapsed.

[00:13:19]So, the NEC have approved that we constitute a provincial task team.

[00:13:26]And that task team will be announced in the next coming week with the mandate fully of the national executive committee that the officials and the national working committee must finalize the composition of the two task teams.

[00:13:43]Thank you very much.

[00:13:47]Thank you, SG.

[00:13:51]Um for that comprehensive statement.

[00:13:55]I now turn to you, colleagues, for some engagement.

[00:14:01]I also see colleagues who are here there at the back.

[00:14:05]I will I will start from this side.

[00:14:10]Uh I see you.

[00:14:14]Uh sorry, I just can't recognize you. I will start from Shazi.

[00:14:20]To To yourself and the gentleman at the back.

[00:14:26]Um good day. Um it's Mzwandile Shazi from Power FM News. I just have two questions, Mr. Balula. Of course, the special NEC meeting happened right before President Cyril Ramaphosa announced um the dismissal of Bathabile Dlamini as the Minister of Social Development.

[00:14:43]Following her firing, um will this in any way affect Dlamini in her position as the leader of the ANC Women's League as an ANC NEC member?

[00:14:55]And um will she be um affected by the step-aside rule?

[00:15:00]Um second question, with regards to ANC deployees who are who are put in cabinets. The president has fired Bathabile Dlamini. He has fired Bongani Bongo as the Minister of Higher Education. And he's also placed Mzwandile Masina, the Minister of Police, under suspension.

[00:15:20]Um should the president be lauded for taking firm action against those embroiled in corruption or should the ANC Is this an indictment on the ANC for fielding poor leadership candidates into government positions um where they end up being fired? Thank you very much.

[00:15:39]Thank you. I proceed to the next row.

[00:15:43]Hello, Nellie Peyton from Reuters. I'm wondering what the ANC thinks of the makeup of the impeachment committee on which I think the party has nine seats.

[00:15:51]Do you think that's fair? And also, do you expect that the president's legal review of the report will delay the impeachment proceedings? Thanks.

[00:16:01]Thank you very much.

[00:16:04]Good morning, SG. Braam Raith from Network 24.

[00:16:09]SG, it seems like the ANC is always in crisis mode before an election. Um, do you view this Phala Phala issue as as a as a crisis for the ANC and how do you plan on combating the public narrative that the ANC is currently in crisis?

[00:16:25]Um, and then just on the Phala Phala issue, um, was there any division with the within the NEC?

[00:16:32]Um, or was it a uh, unanimous support for the president if we can call it that?

[00:16:40]And then also just SG, what was the conversation with the president like?

[00:16:44]Was it because we knew about we know that a couple of years ago there was uh, rumors that the president wanted to resign when this Phala Phala issue first arose. So, what was the conversation around this time? Was it Was it one to convincing to stay? Or did he want to stay?

[00:17:04]Um, and then just lastly, uh, we had an interaction with the leader of um, the Democratic Alliance in the week. Jordan Lee uh, Jordan Hill-Lewis.

[00:17:14]Um, and he he made it very clear that that the that the DA has drawn the battle lines. Um, he mentioned that the ANC is the he's or the DA's biggest opponent in Gauteng, and the DA views Gauteng as the World Cup of the upcoming election. Just your thoughts on that. Thank you, SG.

[00:17:37]Thank you very much.

[00:17:41]We we're done with the the side on the left.

[00:17:45]I don't know where we're going to end me before we end here.

[00:17:48]Okay, still go on.

[00:17:50]May I see the hands?

[00:17:53]I'll start at the back.

[00:18:07]Good eve- Good morning. [clears throat] Um, my name is Zoleka Gqashe from News24. I have a couple of questions, SG, um, relating to first the special ANC NEC meeting. Now, you mentioned what the judgment of the Constitutional Court was not. Um, despite that, it gives effect to the composition of the impeachment committee. So, there's no disputing what what the Constitutional Court judgment says, but what it does is give effect to the composition of the impeachment committee. Now, in terms of that, um, and the engagement that was had, um, in Cape Town. I want to know what the marching orders were that were given to, um, ANC MPs. I'd also like to know if there was any engagement with any GNU partners.

[00:18:58]Um, my understanding as well is that the Deputy President was not part of that engagement. Can I just get clarity on that and know whether that is, um, correct and why he wasn't part of that engagement. and then I'd also like to know in terms of the compilation of the report. You do mention that there was engagement with a senior counsel, but I'd like to know to to what end this report what is the purpose of this report other than ending that specific engagement because it's not the first report that was compiled by the ANC NEC. There was a report that was compiled prior to the elective conference uh and that there was an undertaking. I remember you saying that that would be tabled at the conference, but then there was a U-turn in relation to putting that in the conference. I just like to know to what's the end game in relation to this particular report.

[00:20:04]Um and then I'm hoping that there'll be another round.

[00:20:09]I trust that uh you were able to catch the questions. You were speaking very softly.

[00:20:15]Can I proceed to the next person? Good morning. Muloko Molota from ENCA. I have a couple of questions.

[00:20:23]Does the ANC find find nothing wrong with the president who first had an opportunity following the release of that report to take it on judicial review about 4-5 years back and he decided not to proceed and only when he's being held accountable um he is now taking it on judicial review. And I'm asking this in the context of the the fact that it was the ANC, the president himself has said that report was fundamentally flawed. Why did he not deem important either way even after the national assembly had voted against the adoption of the report. Why did he not say let me proceed nonetheless and uh set this flawed report aside?

[00:21:17]You you do say that as the ANC there shall be accountability for all.

[00:21:24]How did you hold the president accountable following the Palapala scandal?

[00:21:31]So much foreign currency stashed in and furniture.

[00:21:37]And lastly, the president was elected or campaigned at least on a ticket of clean governance, on a ticket of good ethics.

[00:21:48]This Palapala matter and I'm not talking about not going into whether he broke the Constitution provisions of the Constitution or breaker.

[00:22:00]I'm just talking about the head of state in a country that was battling not so long ago to be removed from the gray listing.

[00:22:10]And he stashes money in furniture.

[00:22:15]Does that behavior is it compatible with the values and the ethics of the ANC?

[00:22:25]Thank you very much, UCA. Is there any other person at the back? No.

[00:22:31]All right, I proceed then to here. We'll start right in front.

[00:22:38]May I have the mic, please?

[00:22:45]Shannon Murray Cassy BBC Africa and I'm I want to be the devil's advocate. I'm not a a lawyer, but I want to go slow with this. Please bear with me.

[00:22:58]President Ramaphosa said he's going to take the report on judicial review.

[00:23:04]By the time the top six excluding the person Ramaphosa had a meeting, by the time the NEC had a meeting, uh Ramaphosa, the individual, the ANC member has not submitted court papers.

[00:23:20]However, the ANC overlooked all that.

[00:23:23]And then the ANC said, "Fine, we're going to support the individual, not the president. I'm talking about the individual who is a member of the ANC."

[00:23:31]So, is this not a strategy or a tactic to save the ANC? Because in 2027, you're going to all intents and purposes, uh Ramaphosa, the person won't be the president anymore. If anything happens after 12 months from now, he's out of office either way. Is it not a a a tactic or a strategy by the ANC not to have another president going down?

[00:23:59]Second, but there's a guy in Soweto, a ANC chairperson. He has a illegal tavern. He sells illegal alcohol.

[00:24:09]Now, how will the ANC deal with that branch chairperson selling illegal alcohol, illegal tavern, when it deals differently with Ramaphosa? Because they're both members of the ANC. So, can you explain the logic onto that as well? Last but not least, the public protector says no one and and no one should compare her work to the previous public protector.

[00:24:38]And no one in public, including the media, should compare her nose to the nose of the previous public protector as well. Are you not worried that we're moving to a dictatorship when officials of the state are telling the people, "You can't criticize me. You can't say I'm incompetent and so on. Thank you.

[00:25:02]Um Going to the the second row.

[00:25:06]Ferial.

[00:25:08]Thank you. Ferial Haffajee from the Daily Maverick. Thank you for the briefing. Do you expect a tough campaign given that your president will be facing an impeachment committee which will be live broadcast almost at the same time.

[00:25:21]And is the ANC late out of the blocks with this campaign? I've watched them many years and it does seem that this one um its definition and clarity isn't so obvious to me so late in the day.

[00:25:32]Thank you.

[00:25:34]Thank you. I don't see any other hands.

[00:25:36]Um now going to Okay, that's an afterthought.

[00:25:41]Thank you.

[00:25:43]Mr. Malula, I'm sorry, Siyabonga Lithebe from News 24. Mine is about uh the Mangaung conference. You were in the Eastern Cape recently where you commented that uh the ANC would host the the conference in Mangaung. So, there's speculation that uh the ANC has no money for that. What has happened to that?

[00:26:05]In Mangaung.

[00:26:08]What about it? So, it was supposed to sit um I understand last week.

[00:26:13]So, there's speculation that there is no money for that. We want to know what has happened and if you it has been reported to you why the conference hasn't sat.

[00:26:22]Thank you very much.

[00:26:26]Can we move to your side?

[00:26:35]Uh thank you for the questions.

[00:26:39]Um Power FM, is the ANC fielding uh uh weak candidates?

[00:26:49]Um When a minister is redeployed, speculation is made about a whole lot of things.

[00:26:58]And it has never happened that whenever a minister is redeployed, reasons are given as to what has been considered by the president.

[00:27:08]Who then decides and report to the ANC.

[00:27:11]So, we leave the speculative part about Sisulu.

[00:27:16]But the president have taken a decision in this particular instance uh to strengthen government.

[00:27:23]ANC has deployed a very good ministers who qualify for the positions and who are highly qualified by the way. You can go to each one of them.

[00:27:35]Higher education, mining Mantashe He was a miner.

[00:27:42]Highly qualified, he's now enrolled for a PhD at the age of 70.

[00:27:49]Uh but highly qualified and experienced in the mining industry, Sputla Ramokgopa engineer deployed to head one of the important aspects of our government uh over overcoming load shedding.

[00:28:06]So, the list is endless in that particular cabinet. You can go through them.

[00:28:12]As the Lindiwe Sisulu is highly qualified uh master's degree.

[00:28:21]Uh you can look at all our ministers.

[00:28:24]We don't have a minister in government uh who does not possess academic record.

[00:28:30]You can look at other political parties, you'll get a different story in government.

[00:28:36]So, in government is your choice who you deploy. I'm saying to you ANC ministers in government highly qualified.

[00:28:43]Even deputy ministers that the president have given responsibilities.

[00:28:50]Of course, where there are challenges, South Africans expect the president to act.

[00:28:56]And when the president is not acting, you are actually also complaining.

[00:29:02]I commend where it is necessary. If you believe that the decision that the president have taken is in the right direction, say so.

[00:29:11]Don't say you shouldn't have taken it.

[00:29:14]Uh he have taken the decisions uh and so on.

[00:29:18]And on Senzo Mchunu, which is a topic among others, uh you know that the matter had arisen in a particular context where a policeman called a press conference, made uh uh claims against the minister.

[00:29:36]And in this particular instance, the president had to apply his mind. First among others was to hold the minister accountable by establishing a committee, making it a point that that minister accounts.

[00:29:49]And uh where there is wrongdoing, the president will act.

[00:29:53]But the fact of the matter is that you don't establish a committee and take steps, and then put the person aside.

[00:30:01]Uh and all of that and not hold them accountable.

[00:30:05]Senzo has been in that committee, have appeared in that committee, have been put on a special leave uh while the proceedings of the committee are actually proceeding.

[00:30:16]It is the seriousness of the matters that have been raised that informed the president's decision on the matter.

[00:30:24]So, he has not said he will actually not act on those on those particular issues, and he have actually acted. But uh because of plurality of ideas and differences in society and accepting the fact that we are involved in what is called the national debate.

[00:30:43]A country as big as ours will not see things in the same direction.

[00:30:48]So, to answer your question in a nutshell, we have filled that very strong uh candidates. Uh human beings are not infallible.

[00:30:56]They commit mistakes, but when they do, even with all the qualities they have, uh uh action on the part of the person who's the CEO of South Africa Inc.

[00:31:10]Uh who he happens to be the president, he can take any decision uh on those particular individuals, because being a minister is not permanent.

[00:31:19]Uh it is there because you are given a privilege.

[00:31:23]So, you can be sent back to the party, like uh back to the legislature and so on, and the party will decide what happens uh to you.

[00:31:33]So, the president, in terms of his government, he has maintained a particular way of doing things.

[00:31:40]And he acts whenever it is necessary to do so, and he doesn't give reasons why he had to act uh in this particular instance. I've seen people jumping and claiming victories and all of that.

[00:31:54]A president acts on the basis of information before him, factually.

[00:32:00]And then, on the basis of that, the president acts uh uh uh in terms of his cabinet and so on. It has been like that since Mandela up until today.

[00:32:13]Reuters, um ANC 96, is it fair?

[00:32:23]We believe as the national executive committee, it is fair.

[00:32:27]Uh in a democracy, even though we know that if you apply 40% as in what the ANC got in the election will be totally different. ANC will qualify for 12.

[00:32:41]If you take in 31 seats, but we've understood that the multi-party arrangement for the impeachment, that is a different case. So, we have accepted that.

[00:32:54]As the African National Congress, the formula that has been implemented by the speaker, and all parties have agreed.

[00:33:03]A review will delay impeachment.

[00:33:07]Um it will not because it is exercised in terms of what is at your disposal in terms of the matter that we're dealing with, which is the report of the Section 89 a committee.

[00:33:23]And the court again did not rule to say despite defining the rule, which is something new uh in the court decision uh with jurisprudence, which we're not in argument with, the court in this instance began to define what Parliament must do.

[00:33:42]Which in our thinking uh which we're not making an issue about that, uh we're worried about the encroachment and separation of powers.

[00:33:53]That our judges have got to be alive to that.

[00:33:57]Dictating to what Parliament must do.

[00:34:00]Uh we're not making an issue of it.

[00:34:03]We're examining that particular issue, and we're still looking at this judgment in relation to the separation of powers because we believe that uh to a certain extent, where the court sit down and design rules for Parliament, uh it's encroachment on the separation of powers. Of course, it's debatable in this particular instance, but we are not making an issue about it at the present moment as the African National Congress.

[00:34:32]Uh 420 Look, we are in a constitutional democracy.

[00:34:44]In an election sometime, uh we're involved in this process of uh Constitutional Court.

[00:34:55]Uh it was a 5 days before we vote. There was a a judgment on our former president, which was scathing.

[00:35:04]And basically saying that uh uh he has broken an oath of his office.

[00:35:12]Uh we were basically called delinquents because we were delinquent.

[00:35:19]Correctly so.

[00:35:21]Because we did not follow the law.

[00:35:24]Uh in this particular instance, the Constitutional Court did not judge the president in ways that deal with his oath of office.

[00:35:35]That is a fact.

[00:35:37]The Constitutional Court did not consider the merits of the Section 89 report.

[00:35:45]It actually dealt with the parliamentary process essentially.

[00:35:50]Now, the people in the discourse who want to influence the events of the resignation of the president have basically delved into the merits of the case.

[00:36:04]And they are not dealing with what is before them.

[00:36:07]President Ramaphosa has not been judged by the Constitutional Court on the basis of the Section 89 report.

[00:36:20]And is not even referred to in that report.

[00:36:26]Section 139 give us the pathway in relation to what options are at the disposal of the president, which is the review.

[00:36:38]When When Gondar report came, instead of doing what Public Protector Maton Zela did, we did something unconstitutional.

[00:36:48]So, when you look at the judgment, you look at what are your rights and what is permissible in law.

[00:36:58]So, that you don't become a delinquent.

[00:37:01]We are not stopping processes of Parliament.

[00:37:04]If you exercise your right in terms of review, it will obviously have an impact one way or the other on the other process.

[00:37:13]And you must not say you're stopping the process because the view that Constitutional Court have said go and impeach the president, equally it is wrong.

[00:37:27]Because the Constitutional Court says fix the process.

[00:37:33]Ultimately, that process may lead us into what is called impeachment trial.

[00:37:38]The problem in our society, legal gurus and the media don't educate people.

[00:37:45]They run with perceptions that seek to influence the in outcome of a resignation.

[00:37:53]Political parties have got a right to call for resignation. But you you've got that right and obligation to inform the nation and scholars and everybody else about the correct interpretation of what is before us.

[00:38:12]Because you're going to mislead people because people are going to say that Ramaphosa as a president has Constitutional Court have have ruled that he must be impeached.

[00:38:23]No.

[00:38:25]Did not say that.

[00:38:27]I've never had any platform including analysts who some of them have got big titles.

[00:38:34]PhD and all of that.

[00:38:37]They delve on the merits of what happened at Phala Phala.

[00:38:43]They don't deal with what is before us.

[00:38:45]And that is why the president had to step up and address the nation because there's anxiety that hey, here is a person he's clinging onto the position irrespective of the fact that the Constitutional Court have ruled that he must be impeached.

[00:39:03]So, as much as we've got views, but we must not be economic when it comes to the truth in relation to the outcome. So, we deal with this outcome like I explained.

[00:39:19]On the basis that there is a process outlined that needs to be followed and uh we support that process.

[00:39:27]It has already begun in Parliament.

[00:39:31]So, it is not a crisis.

[00:39:35]It will be a crisis if Constitutional Court delved into issues that are not in its purview in relation to the prayers of the litigants.

[00:39:47]The Constitutional Court dealt with the matter that was brought by those who brought it to them and uh closed it at that point. And from our understanding, that's what we're dealing with.

[00:39:58]And there's nobody who has actually opposed this.

[00:40:02]I've listened to many analysts, Richard Calland very much on point.

[00:40:07]Educative on the matter.

[00:40:10]I've written I've listened to others who are just in a hurry. Ramaphosa must go.

[00:40:18]They then distort the facts.

[00:40:22]Give the facts and at the end of the day maybe say, "No, I believe he must go."

[00:40:27]But here's the fact in law.

[00:40:30]Don't tell society what is not truthful.

[00:40:33]It has been a week now. People have been fed one lie.

[00:40:37]Resignation, resignation. The resignation matter was not before the court.

[00:40:42]It's a speculative matter that arises out of what happened in the past.

[00:40:49]Because at 4:00 President called a press conference and canceled it.

[00:40:54]They thought it would happen now.

[00:40:57]Even today, you've got to locate that resignation.

[00:41:01]What does it mean in relation to what the Constitutional Court have uh decided.

[00:41:08]It's not like before.

[00:41:10]Because somebody came with a report to Judge Ngcobo and said, "There is prima facie evidence, and therefore here's the report." The report was supposed to be taken through a process.

[00:41:20]That report, even itself then when the ANC took decisions, it was informed by the what what the rules of the National Assembly.

[00:41:30]The court have now ruled that those rules were wrong and therefore are set aside. What informed the ANC position at that particular moment when Gwede Mantashe on behalf of the officials went to brief caucus after the NEC had taken a decision was informed by what were the rules of Parliament.

[00:41:54]And uh which we exercised.

[00:41:57]And uh we won the vote on that particular day.

[00:42:01]But everybody else then seemed to forget that particular point.

[00:42:11]So, there's no review will delay the impeachment. The two processes are intertwined and equally the establishment of the committee is not impeachment. There's a whole lot of processes that must be followed.

[00:42:26]That committee might advise or might come to a different conclusion.

[00:42:31]But, it's then to be seen up until you get to what we call now impeachment trial.

[00:42:38]But, the court did not order an impeachment trial on the president.

[00:42:43]But, if it were to come we will deal with it as it comes in every step of the legislature including the review a process in itself.

[00:42:57]Um With that dissenting views, they are not dissenting views. I saw speculative articles that that meeting did not last for long. You were there in Cape Town. I think and some killer are still not here.

[00:43:12]They're still in Cape Town trying to come back to Joburg.

[00:43:16]Uh uh the NEC was unanimous.

[00:43:19]There was no dissenting view in the NEC.

[00:43:25]We are unanimous because there was nothing to dissent.

[00:43:30]Because the report we gave to the NEC was very clear.

[00:43:36]Because the report was not saying do not follow the process.

[00:43:40]Our report as I put it to you and brief you about is informed by the legal standing and at the same time is informed by the Constitutional Court judgment interpretation which is accompanied in substance by a sound legal opinion.

[00:44:02]And that's what is important. So, the NEC was unanimous in terms of his decision. Almost all members spoke in the in the National Executive Committee of the ANC.

[00:44:17]So, I can't deal with Mcebisi Gigaba and people who have our views and talk to you. ANC will speak for itself.

[00:44:26]It doesn't speak through faceless people.

[00:44:30]And the ANC speaking now and without speculation and we've put our views across in terms of what the National Executive Committee have decided.

[00:44:44]We didn't convince the president to stay or not. He applied his mind based on the law and he briefed us. We reflected on it and we believed it is sound.

[00:44:55]And we took it to the NEC. We agreed with the president. And even before he went to make a public pronouncement, he briefed us as the top seven of the ANC.

[00:45:06]And all of us unanimous agreed with the president as the top seven of the African National Congress.

[00:45:13]I'm addressing that because I see you want to address why Mcebisi was not in the meeting.

[00:45:19]So, it means there is a problem. There's no problem.

[00:45:22]We were seven of us together except when six because she was in China as the treasurer.

[00:45:30]We engaged. We agreed. We went to the NEC. The NEC agreed.

[00:45:36]So, [snorts] um leader of the If I'm going every time we convene a press conference, comment on George Hill, I will finish this term talking about him. He's a leader of the DA.

[00:45:52]He's got the right to say whatever he wants to say about the ANC.

[00:45:56]I can't all the time and the ANC respond to George.

[00:46:00]He's a leader of the DA. He's got the to say they want to finish off the ANC.

[00:46:05]Zille said it 20 times.

[00:46:07]Don't you think that the DA want to finish the ANC? They do.

[00:46:13]They want to be next government and they've been failing for 30 years to become the next government and they are not growing either.

[00:46:23]So, they want to grow out of everything they see as an opportunity.

[00:46:27]But we we are resilient. But it's a democracy.

[00:46:31]As a leader of the DA, he's got the views that he has expressed and all of that and that is it.

[00:46:38]He's a leader of the DA elected. He's very new. He wants to be seen to be very very clever and very very militant and leading DA in a particular Give him space. Give the man space.

[00:46:51]Uh not bells, but space.

[00:46:54]Don't give him bells, but space.

[00:46:56]Uh he's expressing himself.

[00:46:58]Every leader of every political party when they express themselves, we can't be running after them and responding to what they say.

[00:47:06]You must be asking him, "What does he mean by that?"

[00:47:09]Uh and that is it. If the ANC wants to engage and I have the mandate to talk to the DA, I do.

[00:47:17]On matters of the GNU and all of that, I talk to the DA, I talk to everybody uh in our country.

[00:47:25]Uh so, we we will continue to do that, but I don't direct the DA if they express views that uh you know uh uh that they express, those are their views.

[00:47:40]Newsroom um effect to the to the composition uh of the committee.

[00:47:51]Um I don't think that uh the composition of the committee give effect to any other thing. It simply deals with what needs to happen.

[00:48:05]Uh post at the court judgement.

[00:48:10]Um Phala Phala report uh newsroom uh you said what is the end game?

[00:48:27]I don't know.

[00:48:30]Yes.

[00:48:42]No, the marching orders is exactly what I explained to you.

[00:48:46]Our members will participate and I've summarized it with discipline and dignity and seriousness every step of the way and constructively.

[00:48:56]That's what is the marching order.

[00:48:58]I I I hear that you said that we were telling people things in in caucus.

[00:49:05]Uh we're not telling them what has not been decided by the NEC.

[00:49:10]Those are the marching orders.

[00:49:12]Uh that you participate here is the process that's where it is.

[00:49:16]And uh uh that is that is the marching orders. Now, this is section 89 report, what you call Phala Phala.

[00:49:28]Uh section 89 report, it will be tabled and we'll deal with it in terms of the processes that need to be followed in terms of the legislation.

[00:49:40]Uh ENCA I think most of you have raised this question, not all, but it borders on ignorance and not following and respectfully I say this because President Ramaphosa after the Section 89 report Judge Sandile was tabled took the matter on review.

[00:50:13]Directed to the Constitutional Court, not using Stalingrad.

[00:50:18]Direct.

[00:50:19]And the Constitutional Court said, "No, go back."

[00:50:23]Because by that time Parliament had taken a majority decision.

[00:50:31]Uh which is what you know.

[00:50:34]And therefore he said, "Based on legal advice, it rendered the review at that time moot."

[00:50:44]Because the matter in terms of Parliament uh through the ANC majority uh was basically uh uh set aside.

[00:50:56]In terms of the vote.

[00:50:58]Now, you keep peddling this thing that president did not.

[00:51:04]Go check the facts. He did.

[00:51:07]And then he went to the Constitutional Court. The Constitutional Court itself ruled on that matter.

[00:51:14]And said, "This thing belong to the legislature. Go there."

[00:51:19]The papers were filed.

[00:51:22]Done and dusted.

[00:51:24]And then the matter was rendered moot in terms of the language of the law.

[00:51:30]If I'm wrong you can call me at 12:00 at night.

[00:51:35]That what SG of the ANC saying is misleading the public. That did not happen.

[00:51:43]I am saying this is is happened.

[00:51:46]But you keep saying that the president the president is coming back now because he's been held accountable. Incorrect.

[00:51:58]The matter is taken to court by the EFF. Parliament is ordered by the Constitutional Court in terms of the judgment to start the process in the seventh administration. Those processes have been followed.

[00:52:18]The report will be given to the president and tabled in Parliament and all of that and the president have told you in public and taken the nation in confidence. I hear people say the president should have taken the the nation in confidence. I realize they are now running out of ideas.

[00:52:35]The president have taken the nation in confidence as their president employed by them that I'm going to review this report.

[00:52:44]He can't just stay in office and it is ordinary. Every time he goes left he's asked, "What are you going to do?"

[00:52:51]He's employed by South Africans.

[00:52:53]He has told South Africans through a family meeting that he's going to take the matter on review.

[00:52:59]There is nobody who have said legally that is not permissible.

[00:53:04]And there is nobody who have argued today that president has broken the oath of office by taking the report on review when the Constitutional Court in itself have not ruled on the merits of the case.

[00:53:20]Now, just for records, president did take the the matter on review.

[00:53:27]He did.

[00:53:29]And that's what has happened.

[00:53:33]Foreign currency stashed.

[00:53:35]Uh we want us now to debate the the merits.

[00:53:40]But uh let's explain this case.

[00:53:43]By now, there's a number of things that have happened since this matter was reported.

[00:53:50]The Hawks, where the matter was reported, was taken on board. The Public Protector, the Financial Intelligence Center, the Reserve Bank, SARS.

[00:54:05]Now, they've not said that anyone has got a case to answer in relation to that.

[00:54:10]And two, these dollars you're talking about were found in a farm of the president.

[00:54:18]Whether they were in couches or wherever they were found, they were in there was a break-in in the farm of the president, and to that extent, there is a case in court in terms of the break-in.

[00:54:33]That's what has happened.

[00:54:37]So, the onus is on the owner of the dollars to explain. And if he's on the wrong side of the law, uh then that is that will be it.

[00:54:48]And the president have said that I'm subjecting myself.

[00:54:52]And there was a break-in at the farm of the president. It's not like dollars were found in the boot.

[00:55:01]They were found in a farm called Palapala.

[00:55:05]That's what was being investigated.

[00:55:10]And now, people then say no all sorts of things and so on and so on.

[00:55:15]Um what should this and that should have actually happened.

[00:55:21]The only source of engagement in relation to this issue is the institutions we have created to probe all of these particular questions.

[00:55:33]Now, these matters have been ventilated there.

[00:55:37]Now, is this compatible with ANC values?

[00:55:44]ANC values do not say people must steal.

[00:55:48]Has the president stolen?

[00:55:52]He didn't steal, they stole from him.

[00:55:58]Has he stolen something?

[00:56:01]Uh and so on, has he broken the law and all of that?

[00:56:05]Uh that is the matter that must be probed and it has been probed thus far.

[00:56:12]And I don't want to delve into the details of that. And you know what is the outcome of that process.

[00:56:19]Kasi FM, your your your your your your comparison with Tavern Kasi BC Africa, not Tavern.

[00:56:30]Oh. Kasi BC Africa.

[00:56:33]You change every day.

[00:56:36]>> [laughter] >> Okay. Okay. Kasi BC Africa. Okay. Kasi BC Africa. Okay.

[00:56:45]Kasi BC Africa.

[00:56:48]Um I'm not aware of this Tavern guy, but if anybody Yes. Uh your brother is an example that >> [laughter] >> that that does not that does not exist. Even the Tavern guy, if he's arrested among others and so on, is found to be on the wrong side of the law, uh the ANC will do what is right, uh which is what we have done with all our members. The law must take its course.

[00:57:18]And that's what is important.

[00:57:21]Uh for real, it's going to be a tough campaign like all.

[00:57:26]Um I don't know whether we'll be conducting the campaign uh with the impeachment trial in place.

[00:57:36]I don't know.

[00:57:38]Uh that's still to be seen.

[00:57:41]Uh but it's going to be a tough campaign in any event.

[00:57:45]And uh we believe that uh our president is an asset in terms of leading that campaign uh of the ANC.

[00:57:53]Um and we are confident of victory.

[00:57:57]If you see now in the Northern Cape where done very well this past week in the by-elections.

[00:58:04]We won a by-election in Northern Cape and increase our numbers and we outlast the DA.

[00:58:11]So, we've been working very hard in the strongholds of our opponents.

[00:58:17]Of course, there are areas where we are weak.

[00:58:20]Uh our main concern is that we need to win big in our constituencies and then not with uh small margins, 2,000 in the election campaign, it will be totally different because a ward or a VD you've got to win it with 15,000, 20,000, 30,000 uh in order to balance the PR. So, uh that is what is is important for us.

[00:58:47]Um When it comes to um uh all these challenges will be faced with.

[00:58:58]It's interesting, you know, that the ANC in terms of its track record of fighting corruption in the country including under Ramaphosa speak for itself.

[00:59:13]And a a number of interventions have been made.

[00:59:17]Uh a number of commission and laws have been passed.

[00:59:21]And now we are focused on strengthening the capacity of the state.

[00:59:26]Uh SIU, you can mention Judge Nugent when it comes to SARS dealing with matters in that regard.

[00:59:36]The PRECCA Act which has actually been passed to deal with matters.

[00:59:42]Now, anyone who has by a corruption will not do those things.

[00:59:46]And there's a there's a catalog of these interventions that have been made.

[00:59:52]Up to Zondo and now Matlala the commission.

[00:59:56]When president established Matlala critics were all over. Yeah, yes, another commission.

[01:00:04]But they are not talking now when Matlala is investigating and biting.

[01:00:09]People have been arrested and you can see these arrests are not frivolous.

[01:00:14]They are based on substance. Work has been done to clean the system.

[01:00:21]And uh otherwise we would have just said at that time deal with allegations by removing people and don't investigate.

[01:00:31]It's like, you know, plastering a sore point and then you don't clean it.

[01:00:36]And then you just plaster it it keep coming back. What the president have done was to get to the sore, clean it and uh through the Matlala commission is doing exactly that.

[01:00:47]Corruption alleged in the police, we have known about that.

[01:00:51]I led the police in this country.

[01:00:54]I know and I see some of the things that are happening.

[01:00:57]And I know them.

[01:00:59]And I know we're working very hard to clean those things.

[01:01:02]So, when I see Matlala commission and we see it the way we see it uh and doing the work that we have promised to South Africans it's it's uh heartwarming.

[01:01:15]South Africans are very happy.

[01:01:18]Uh they don't want this thing of criminals flaunting wealth that is unaccounted for.

[01:01:25]Something has been done about it.

[01:01:28]It's been done. These questionable characters, you see them very rich overnight.

[01:01:34]And therefore, now Malanga have shown us that no, these people steal.

[01:01:39]And the work has been done. It's not easy to deal with organized crime.

[01:01:44]And then when organized crime is led by suspect criminals who masquerade as cops.

[01:01:52]When we adopted the national crime prevention strategy in 1996, we dealt in detail with how we deal with organized crime.

[01:02:03]It's not easy to to arrest if you don't have tools and they're supported by the law to deal with organized crime. Now, you find a fellow who's busy with organized crime is implicated to having arrangements with crooks.

[01:02:20]Uh, there's no way you can catch these people.

[01:02:24]And so on.

[01:02:26]We We support everyone who does business legit, including tenders.

[01:02:33]But we won't support corruption.

[01:02:37]And that is why we tighten the laws uh to deal with that to deal with those particular matters. Mangaung conference is supposed to take place. It will take place.

[01:02:48]There's no money issues there. It's just a mismanagement uh of the conference.

[01:02:54]Um it is ready and it should be concluded. If it is not concluded now, it will have to take place after the election.

[01:03:02]We are left with two conferences. It is West Rand that must take place this coming week.

[01:03:08]Uh we have had to deal with litigation processes there and many other things.

[01:03:12]And Mangaung, that's all.

[01:03:14]And Eastern Cape provincial conference.

[01:03:18]So, those are the only conferences.

[01:03:20]All the work is on deck now.

[01:03:23]Preparing structures, selection process, uh and so on. We are selecting candidates left, right, and center. The process of selecting mayors has begun.

[01:03:34]And like I we promised you, by June we'll do that. July we will launch our campaign.

[01:03:40]Uh election campaign, but the work to prepare for the elections has begun uh across uh the length and breadth uh of the country.

[01:03:50]Uh thank you very much.

[01:03:56]Thank you very much um SG.

[01:04:00]Um there is an appetite for a second um segment of this discussion.

[01:04:08]So, I'm going to go. I think that's a follow-up.

[01:04:13]Um the Yes.

[01:04:16]That's a Is that a follow-up?

[01:04:18]If you can proceed.

[01:04:23]Try and Try and raise your voice for benefit.

[01:04:30]Good morning. I hope you can hear me. Um SG, maybe I should be more pointed with my question in terms of marching orders.

[01:04:38]Was there a decision in the NEC that what comes out of the or in the impeachment committee and the establishment of the impeachment committee that MPs must tow the line?

[01:04:53]That is my question. I also would like to know um in terms of I know we already touched on um the MP dollar ship, but I'd like to know I think there was a disciplinary process that was taking place or inquiry that was taking place within the ANC. I'd like to know what the outcome of that process was or is, please. Thank you.

[01:05:25]Thank you very much. Let me just take the brother next to you. Sure. Mlungisi Mkhungo again from ENCA. Just to Oh, Mlungisi. Sorry. Oh, sure. Quick questions.

[01:05:35]The former speaker um Nosiviwe Mapisa-Nqakula has essentially said the manner in which the ANC handled this matter by voting against the establishment or referring that report to the impeachment committee um was wrong and that uh she feels like hiding her head in shame.

[01:05:59]Do you share that sentiment as the ANC given the fact that we've been here before? Um we know how the Nkandla matter matter was dealt with. Secondly and lastly, on the issue of the president having approached the Constitutional Court before to review this. The Constitutional Court did say that it doesn't have exclusive jurisdiction, but it did not say he must go back to a parliament. In other words, he had the alternative or recourse of going to the High Court to say even after Parliament has voted against the report, I want to clear my name and it is on that basis that I'm saying it took about 4 years for him to now institute what he ought to have done back in 2022. That is where I'm I'm asking to say do you see nothing wrong as the ANC to say when you had an opportunity, you didn't use it. You're only using it now that processes are getting into place again.

[01:07:00]All right. Thank you, ENCA. Is there a hand? Another hand there at the back?

[01:07:05]No.

[01:07:06]Okay. I then come down.

[01:07:10]Uh back to Khusela, I don't want to get it wrong, so I'll just say Khusela.

[01:07:19]Shannon Monyane Khusela Bheki Africa and member in good standing of the Press Council of South Africa.

[01:07:26]Thank you. Chairperson, you blue blue ticked my questions. Let me repeat them directly. One, the president, as we sitting here today, while she's doing the press briefing, has not filed any court papers. So, the ANC NEC and the top six, excluding the president, had a meeting without any valid court papers being filed. So, if the president don't file the papers in the next 90 days or 12 months, uh the issue is moot. He never filed the papers. Second point, uh the public protector, I I I I I think I don't have to repeat that one. But, the public protector basically is telling us, as the public, as the media, she can't be criticized. She's the queen of England. Nobody must say anything about her, and she's a public official.

[01:08:23]Uh I just want to add one more thing.

[01:08:24]Now that you talked of your police minister and so on. Now, the Madlala Commission is busy with the final report. Let's say in that report, uh hypothetically speaking, the president will then fire the the previous minister, Senzo Mchunu, and then the acting minister gets replaced by somebody else. Are you available to be the next police minister? Thank you.

[01:08:52]Okay, thank you.

[01:08:54]Um Uh new question from the >> Sorry for Sorry for the laughter. I'm not diminishing the question. Just unexpected.

[01:09:03]>> [laughter] >> News 24 Mr. Maluleka, we want to know we know that the PECs and the RECs have to or have been given the choice to bring about a pool of 20 mayoral candidates in the municipal elections. So now we are 6 months away from the elections and we want to know if the ANC can give us an update on that process and recently the ANC also said that it would be head hunting mayoral candidates. Want to know if any candidates have been interviewed so far and if so, how many?

[01:09:42]Thank you. Let me take you at the back.

[01:09:47]Yes.

[01:09:49]Good morning, Zara Cronaveldt, SABC News. This is just a clarification question on my side regarding the Telkom matter. Am I right in my understanding that the ANC is still awaiting that brief from the president on his decision to remove her and following that the ANC will then due process will then follow.

[01:10:11]Does the ANC have a timeline on how soon they would want to wrap that up as this is probably a major issue of concern for the party. Thank you very much.

[01:10:21]Thank you very much. I then move on.

[01:10:25]Um the last hand.

[01:10:33]But I didn't hear from Network fitting 20 again. SG, I spoke to the presidency.

[01:10:39]I think it was a week ago. They confirmed that >> [clears throat] >> the president and the former president Jacob Zuma they had a meeting or they are going to have a meeting at Nkandla. Do you know anything about this meeting because it seems like it's a very secretive operation around that meeting. I just want to know what what did what what's the details being discussed there? The presidency said it's both political and the engagement is also going to touch on matters relating to the country. That that's all they said. Do you know anything about this? Thank you so much.

[01:11:16]Thank you very much, Mr. Chief.

[01:11:33]Um Thank you very much, newsroom.

[01:11:42]No, we don't say MPs must tow the line.

[01:11:44]We brief them about the party position.

[01:11:48]And that's what is important. And the party position is exactly what I've explained to you now. And this is what was explained to uh the MPs of the ANC in caucus. And therefore, this is what must be executed, which is lawful.

[01:12:11]Which is lawful.

[01:12:13]And uh there's nothing that we said here to you. If you so believe that what we said is on the wrong side of the law, and uh we briefed our MPs to basically disregard the law and do wrong things, let's argue about that.

[01:12:32]This is the line of the ANC in relation to the court judgment. All parties exercise that.

[01:12:40]There is no party that does not have the line to its public representatives.

[01:12:47]So, it can't be different to the African National Congress.

[01:12:51]And uh what we have outlined here is what we've outlined to our MPs.

[01:12:58]Sisisi has to allow the process in the ANC.

[01:13:02]She has appeared before the Integrity Commission. That work is not finalized.

[01:13:09]Uh I don't have a report from the Integrity Commission that has finalized the work.

[01:13:15]I've checked with the Reverend Frank Chikane.

[01:13:18]He said to me they are not done. So, I've seen speculations here being made about the Integrity Commission and what it has decided. It is not decided.

[01:13:28]Sisisi has appeared Umam Sisisi have appeared before the Integrity Commission.

[01:13:35]And uh once they are done, they'll give us that report.

[01:13:38]In the NEC meeting, I've got about four to five Integrity Commission reports before me now that I will table before the officials.

[01:13:48]And uh the Integrity Commission will present those reports to the NEC.

[01:13:52]Integrity matters are part of the standard ANC agenda in every meeting. Sisisi is not on the agenda. That matter is still before them. They are dealing with it.

[01:14:05]So, I hope it clarifies everybody in relation to to that matter.

[01:14:13]ANC-A the speaker You were asking about the speaker.

[01:14:23]Oh, um uh Comrade uh Mapisa-Nqakula is a leader of long standing in the ANC.

[01:14:38]And a former speaker and a former Minister of Defense.

[01:14:43]Uh she is entitled to express her reflections uh on their own conduct and the conduct of their caucus at that time.

[01:14:54]I'm not going to enter into personal exchanges uh with a leader of this movement through the media.

[01:15:01]Uh rather, what I will say is this among others.

[01:15:07]Parties are allowed to call for a three-line whip.

[01:15:13]And they are authorized a three-line whip, that is public information.

[01:15:21]We empathize We sympathize with the personal difficulties that the former speaker is going through.

[01:15:29]Now is not the time to deal with matters uh publicly.

[01:15:35]The office of the secretary general is not in the practice of confirming or denying every reflection a comrade may share on a podcast.

[01:15:45]Because our teachings in the organization, you don't jump with the rest and express your opinion. You approach the organization.

[01:15:56]That's what the principled leader does.

[01:15:59]Well, this behavior has become very much a common these days.

[01:16:05]We don't know whether it's because of the gap of leadership track record that those who came before us think that they can say anything, anyhow, anytime to the total disregard of the party.

[01:16:22]Nomvula has never called me as the SG of the ANC post the judgment and expressed the views that she has expressed, which she is entitled to uh in this particular instance, which is very much uh unfortunate.

[01:16:43]Uh You are you are again acting on this question.

[01:16:48]The president in his presentation in public again, he explained.

[01:16:56]The Constitutional Court decided in the manner in which it decided. The president did file for a review.

[01:17:06]The legal counsel advised that the matter is moot.

[01:17:13]Because the National Assembly have laid the matter to rest up until it was revived now.

[01:17:23]That is fact.

[01:17:25]So, let's interrogate moot.

[01:17:29]That the National Assembly when the president when the president was basically taking a decision to take matters on review, which National Assembly decided.

[01:17:45]The Constitutional Court did listen and took the decision that it did.

[01:17:53]And in this particular instance, the matter was moot because at the National Assembly had decided uh on the matter.

[01:18:03]Which is a fact.

[01:18:04]Now, we can't say that uh president was running away from accountability.

[01:18:11]Running away from accountability would have meant that he would not have wanted to do this thing expeditiously in the manner in which he did by approaching uh the apex court on the matter. He would have gone in the normal way of doing things.

[01:18:32]A high court and so on and so on. But, he approached the Constitutional Court directly.

[01:18:38]And if you listen to legal advice and concept, you act accordingly.

[01:18:43]And I in this particular instance, I think for those who practice law will agree that indeed that matter was moot at that moment up until today.

[01:18:56]So, let us not harp on the untruths that president made a pronouncement about taking the matters to court and it did not act. South Africans may not know or they may not know, they may not they may not be reminded. And we're reminding them that that commitment was fulfilled at that moment when the president had made that decision um at the time when the Section 89 report was filed before cabinet. That is a fact.

[01:19:34]um Court papers not filed.

[01:19:39]That's not a material thing. They can be filed even next week.

[01:19:44]The president have taken you in confidence and said that he's going to take it on review.

[01:19:51]Whether he does it this afternoon or tomorrow, but he has said that so that you are not perplexed tomorrow.

[01:20:00]If he did not address the nation as a sitting president and told them that I am deciding to take this matter on review and that is what I'm going to do.

[01:20:11]You were going to say that president is sitting in office is not briefing the nation since the ConCourt judgment.

[01:20:18]The president felt obligated to brief the nation and to tell them what he's going to do in relation to the outcome of the court judgment. And he respected the outcome of that court judgment.

[01:20:33]He did not despise, denigrate, undermine the the courts.

[01:20:39]Even though the courts were not about him.

[01:20:42]They were about the process in Parliament.

[01:20:45]But the head of the president is being called that he must resign on a matter that was not about him in the Constitutional Court, but was about the parliamentary process in relation to the section 89 report.

[01:20:58]Not even the merits of it, of which the president have outlined that he intend to challenge those reports on the grounds that he have explained.

[01:21:09]Now, we have said that no, it is permissible in terms of the law, also in terms of the judgment.

[01:21:18]CJ Maya says in the judgment 139 that you can follow the pathway in this manner in relation to the review. And that is what we have endorsed.

[01:21:31]If the president had decided that no, or the ANC take a decision that don't do that, uh we'll then be circumventing things in this particular instance.

[01:21:43]Uh PP statements um obviously the public protector is the public protector of the people.

[01:21:53]So, he must listen to the people. So, uh uh police minister, I take it in just because I can't go back there.

[01:22:03]>> [laughter] >> I suppose it was just said in just.

[01:22:09]No, I can't go I can't go there. You can see I'm full-time uh here at Luthuli House.

[01:22:15]So, we have very capable people who can do that job in government at the present moment.

[01:22:24]News24 mayoral candidates, that process have begun.

[01:22:28]When we have reached its conclusion, we will announce our candidates. That's the decision we've taken.

[01:22:35]But we have gone public, we have invited, and we are we are receiving a lot of feedback in terms of mayoral candidates.

[01:22:44]So for us, if you are a citizen of this country, you are ready to serve the people of South Africa, you are capable, you'll be considered for a mayoral position by the ANC. We are doing the same even with councilors.

[01:23:01]You want to serve the people of South Africa and the people want you to serve them and you've got capabilities, you will serve. The ANC has always been doing that. We have selected councilors through community public participation, and we are continuing to do that. Even the mayoral candidates, which will be interviewed, shortlisted by the officials, we are doing the same. The deadlines, just to bring you up to speed, the shortlisting is coming to an end now.

[01:23:33]So we are interviewing mayoral candidates for the metros and the secondary cities in the country.

[01:23:43]So that process now is going to begin where the top seven is going to interview, and then by June, we will announce our candidates.

[01:23:55]I've answered the issue of CCC.

[01:24:00]The process is integrity commission.

[01:24:04]The integrity commission is seized with the matter. The report is not final.

[01:24:10]When the report is final, it will be given to the SG, like all other reports.

[01:24:16]The SG will table the report to the national executive committee to deliberate on it and take a decision about what must happen in terms of their recommendations.

[01:24:30]Meeting with the Zuma and president I'm not aware of it.

[01:24:34]But all of those things do happen in politics. Whether they are underground or by phone, they do happen.

[01:24:42]It will not be strange if they meet.

[01:24:45]I saw them hugging there in Swaziland.

[01:24:47]It was nice.

[01:24:49]So if leaders meet and they have agreed to meet, they can meet.

[01:24:54]If there's a need for us to be briefed about their discussions, we will be briefed.

[01:24:59]If there's a need for us to execute anything from those discussions, we will deliberate and execute.

[01:25:06]So when I meet with DA, EFF people and everyone else, it's normal in politics.

[01:25:14]I am the center of the ANC by virtue of the SG. So I hear that Judge Hill saying that the ANC people are speaking to him. He can speak to everyone as long as it's not me, it's not ANC.

[01:25:28]So he must not go around and say ANC is asking me this.

[01:25:33]It will only be me or anyone mandated by me that they go and talk to the DA.

[01:25:44]As long as it is not sanctioned, if you meet in a beer hall, in a soccer match, I might meet Helen Zille at the Pirates match this weekend.

[01:25:53]So it doesn't mean anything.

[01:25:56]Which I don't believe she's our supporter, but it's okay. So we will we will meet at the match. It will be nice to meet with Zille at the Pirates match. So there are channels of political parties engagement and so on.

[01:26:13]So that is why when you meet with person of the DA or anybody approaching you, you ask first what mandate do you carry? Then you will say, "SGF asked me to talk to you."

[01:26:26]And then that is it. No, I just want us to have a an informal discussion.

[01:26:31]Uh coffee, beer, wine, or whiskey.

[01:26:36]Or let's just talk about the future of South Africa. Politicians are civilized.

[01:26:40]And then it's normal.

[01:26:42]Just like you, if you can ask me now, "SGI, I want to have a one-on-one with you."

[01:26:47]People won't ask me, "What were you doing with Net Virk?"

[01:26:52]I I want to understand you better because in a press conference I didn't hear you properly. If I have time, we will sit and talk.

[01:27:00]Uh and uh it's normal. That's how we need to drive things. It happens like that. Thank you very much.

[01:27:09]Thank you very much, colleagues, for your presence.

[01:27:12]Um we are adjourned.

[01:27:16]Thank you.