ANC Women’s League to convene a special National Executive Committee meeting

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[00:00:00]ANC Women's League is set to convene a special National Executive Committee meeting today to discuss its president's future. The meeting will deliberate on the Integrity Commission findings against Ace Magashule. She was referred to the disciplinary committee on allegations of bringing the party into disrepute. Earlier this month, President Cyril Ramaphosa fired Magashule from her post as Social Development Minister following claims of corruption, misconduct, and misuse of a public funds. She's accused of failing to declare luxury cars donated to the ANC Women's League, giving them to her children instead. Magashule has also been accused of making irregular appointments in her department.

[00:00:45]All right, I'm now joined by political analyst Professor Zamafuje Mbajwe. Prof, a very good morning to you. Thank you so much for your time and for joining us.

[00:00:53]So, today the ANC Women's League is having a special NEC meeting, and they also expected to endorse [clears throat] Magashule's removal. But, just a few weeks ago, 90% of that very same structure had backed her. What has changed? What is Was this a genuine genuine moral conviction after the Integrity Commission findings, or do we see this as political self-preservation?

[00:01:21]>> Hey, good morning, Kathlego. Good morning to to your viewers.

[00:01:25]Well, this is also very important your observation is very important. You will recall that politicians have different ways of doing things. All I can say is that most politicians or political leaders' followers cannot be trusted because they they move with the flow.

[00:01:46]When they support a particular leader, they support on on on on basis of various reasons. But, in this particular case, I will say those who said they supported her before her removal was on the basis of the principle that she was a leader at the time and she was also given a responsibility by the president.

[00:02:08]Now now that they say they are no longer supporting her, it's also on the basis of the outcome of the integrity committee which found her guilty of misconduct. And I think those who say they are no longer supporting her, they are it it is it is on the basis of the principle that a leader that has been found not to be principled and a leader that has been found to be unethical on various decisions that are made. So the followers and the members of the of the NC, especially the NC Women's League, have a a full right to say they are no longer in support of that particular leader, especially if you look at the the findings, you will see that there are a lot of areas where uh they say she has been abusing women, she she have not been standing on the principle of women empowerment, women support and protection of women.

[00:03:05]>> Speaking of those findings, I mean the the integrity commission found her guilty on four counts and this, like you say, includes abusing women, yet she's leading an organization whose entire mandate is is to protect women from abuse. Can the NC Women's League, if they continue to defend her, credibly continue championing for gender-based violence, especially with those issues after harboring such a leader for quite some time?

[00:03:35]>> Well, I I don't see NC Women's League supporting her, especially on the basis of the outcomes.

[00:03:42]Remember, every time when a leader have to be elected or when a structure have to be elected, there are always different the or different opinions from different people who those who support the leader and those who are not supporting a leader. And at this point even during her election there are those who are not supporting her. And now I think at this point there was a strong uh case against her leadership.

[00:04:09]And those who supported her uh will also be in support of those who are not supporting her. And that's why I'm saying I don't see her coming uh coming uh back as a leader after this weekend. Mhm. And I think uh there's always a sentiment that uh women are very vocal in the fight against gender-based violence and against women abuse.

[00:04:33]But in instances of this nature, you will see that when a woman is abusing another woman there are no strong sentiments and there are no strong matches or uh or a gesture which says uh there must be a protection against women. So, these sentiments are are primarily made when there's an abuse of women by a man. But we we are yet to see a strong sentiments from those who are protecting the right of women uh making strong comments again on on this particular issue. So, that you will see that they are very much genuine against the abuse of women. And I think the ANC Women's League will have to take a very strong stance against against the conduct of the president of the ANC Women's League.

[00:05:23]>> Certainly. I mean one of the recommendations made is that she resigns as a member of parliament. The DA has pointed out that if Dlamini resigns as an MP, parliamentary ethics processes would fall away entirely. Is the ANC's instruction to to resign from parliament a mechanism to shield her from the most rigorous form of accountability?

[00:05:47]>> Well, the ANC is an organization have a right to decide who they deploy into parliament and who they decide to recall from parliament.

[00:05:55]And at this point it will be irresponsible of anyone to say they are trying to shield her because all political parties have a right to decide who they deploy and who they recall in parliament.

[00:06:08]And and probably we are yet to see how the ANC is going to deal with the with the findings. Now, how how is she being punished for the misconduct as a member now, not just as a member of parliament or as a leader of the ANC Women's League. And I think at this point the ANC is trying by all means to make sure that they are dealing with any characters that suggest that the ANC is a corrupt organization. They are I don't think the ANC will want to associate itself, especially the leadership, with with with the with the current president of the ANC Women's League after this.

[00:06:48]>> Mhm. So, this has invoked some other names from the ANC Women's League who have been removed from structures that being Nomgabane Mapisa-Nqakula and Nomvula Mokonyane. All of these women removed from positions while some say you have someone like Ace Magashule who still sits at home on full pay and Malusi Gigaba who continued in his role despite corruption allegations. Is the gender bias argument factually defensible or is it being weaponized to distract from the seriousness of these specific allegations?

[00:07:22]>> Well, I wouldn't say the gender bias is is a fact here because the conditions are not the same. Maybe what could be at the at the table right now is the processes that are being followed to to conduct investigation against the leaders of the ANC and especially against the ministers because I will say this one in this particular case there is a there's an outcome from the from the from the committee from the ethics committee of the ANC.

[00:07:53]>> Mhm.

[00:07:54]>> So at this point I will suggest that maybe those who think that there is a biasness in terms of the gender and how the leaders of the ANC are being dealt with on the basis of the of of the gender. I will say maybe they should have suggested that uh the suspended minister of uh safety and security will also be subjected to the same process. Because um I don't think it's a fair reason to say he has not been dismissed simply because he is a man. I will say let him go through the same process of the disciplinary hearing and the outcome of the disciplinary hearing then will have to be enforced by the by the president and by the by the ANC leadership.

[00:08:38]>> Mhm. So if the the ANC Women's League, I mean, they wield what? 10% of um voting power at ANC conferences, if the women in that party feel that they they are systemically sidelined, what would be the realistic political consequences for the ANC should there be a fracture within this electoral liability?

[00:09:03]>> Well, the ANC Women's League plays a very significant role not just by having the 10% input to contribution.

[00:09:11]But they are also very influential. The ANC Women's League is very influential in who become a leader or on how on who become a leader whether at a provincial level or at a national level. And remember uh next year will be a very critical year of the ANC >> Mhm.

[00:09:30]>> because uh the ANC will elect its own uh national leadership. So whatever that is happening now will have a very serious impact and consequences on who become a leader next year.

[00:09:42]So, I think it's very important to also treat this matter as a matter of urgent on how >> Certainly.

[00:09:51]>> the women's leadership is dealing with the matter, but also not saying that those who are doing wrong things must be must be treated with kids gloves.

[00:10:01]>> And shielded.

[00:10:02]>> All I'm saying is that they need to ensure that the women's fully understand the process that have been followed and also dismantle the ideas that the the women who are leaders are treated differently compared to men who are leaders.

[00:10:18]Now, the perception that you have presented here is very important. And I think the ANC will have to deal with that perception harshly to say why the Minister of Police is not dismissed while the Minister of the the the current leadership of the ANC Women's League is dismissed. And I'm saying it's because of the process that have been followed and I think the ANC will have to take that into account and I think the women's league in this weekend have to take a very serious stance to say to ask questions >> Right.

[00:10:50]>> and demand answers from the leadership of the ANC on how the ministers are treated differently when the issues are even though are not the same but they are very much related.

[00:11:01]>> All right, Prof. Thank you so much for your time. We will be hearing from the ANC Women's League when they hold that briefing a little later on with regards to these outcomes. That's Professor Zondo Khumalo.