Zimbabwe’s young people refuse to stay silent, speaking out boldly on governance and accountability.

追加: 2026-05-24

[00:00:00]Hello viewers and thank you so much uh once again. This is the big talk with me Costa. Today we have got another episode uh with uh youth accountability initiative founding director Mr. Kathet Masio. I'm going to give you an opportunity to meet our viewers and also in briefly telling us what is youth accountability initiative.

[00:00:25]>> Okay. Thank you very much uh Costa for hosting the young people especially youth accountability initiative to this good and growing program and space and to talk about youth accountability initiative. I think we should start talking about you know the idea behind you know us sitting down as young people to say let us come and conceptualize an organization a movement that can be able to address the fundamentals within our country as young people have realized that one of the critical national questions in Zimbabwe is the issues to do accountability that's why people we see people can you easily and willy-nilly give things without being questioned without you know knowing exactly where the money is coming from. So we sat down and we said no let us start by addressing the fundamentals and we said no we want something that is datadriven. So in 2024 when the general was out we you know did some mainstreaming as far as social media is concerned whereby we were putting in place the issues that was being raised by order general and one of the issues that we pursued number one was the issue around ministry of youth which brought about 17 motor vehicles.

[00:01:52]Seven were delivered, 10 were undelivered until now. And these motor vehicles were bought in 2021. And on the seven that were delivered, three were not in the name of the ministry. So it means they were registered maybe in someone's name or they were not even registered.

[00:02:11]>> Apart from that, there were issues around NASA. You know NASA back in 2003 bought land that is approximately worth 1 million and that land till today has not been you know reclaimed. So what does it mean? It mean that you know the money was paid what was paid to a certain individual a pseudo company you know and the address of the company does not even exist and general keeps on repeating this issue and it's not being addressed and we went to the high court with that issue and we are still waiting you know for the legal processes to take you know its course. So this was the background of us now sitting down to say no each and every time auditor general comes with issues but there is no structured engagement structured intervention of young people to be able to deal with these critical issues of accountability thus sitting down as young people creating this movement called youth accountability initiative.

[00:03:15]There are quite a number of organizations.

[00:03:17]>> Yes.

[00:03:17]>> That do more or less similar work as of like of the organization.

[00:03:23]>> Yes.

[00:03:23]>> So, but I want to find out what is so unique about this youth initiative project or vision.

[00:03:30]>> Yes.

[00:03:30]>> Yes. What is so unique about you because there are so many organizations that are talking about accountability issues and so forth. Could be different names mention organization like Zim codes, accountability lab there many of these.

[00:03:43]What's so unique about yours?

[00:03:45]>> So what happens with the issues to do with driving change? Change can be driven only with one kind of movement.

[00:03:57]That's why you see even in politics you so have so many political parties them trying to push the same agenda. life is about making sure that they address the innermost aspirations of citizens in that specific country. And coming directly to your question in terms of how then are we distinct in terms of our intervention with the issues to do with accountability. Number one, this starts by the fact that it's a youthled organization. These organizations are organizations that are effectively working. But if you remember these are organization formed during you know you know the time of the rise of the opposition and so forth and we're trying to think to say as young people can we not have a youthled voice that can be able to lure to attract youths so that they can be able to start to engage in issues that really do matter. And our areas of intervention also are in complimentary sense to those who are already established within this you know work that we are doing you know that's why you see us now trying to intervene if you go on Tik Tok you realize that you know most of the videos that we post because it's a youth le youth energy they trend around issues to do with taxes around issues to do with natural resources you know the programs that we are doing or moved away from Twitter spaces. We're now doing you know Tik Tok lives. Recently we hosted honorable Makum and 2.4 you know 2,400 viewers tuned into that live. It shows how we are trying to redefine how we engage young people. We are on Saturday we are going to have a Facebook live to discuss about these issues. So our idea, our ideology is centered around how we can resocialize the youths. Our premise, our thought process is to say we cannot resocialize the youths in the boardrooms. We cannot resocialize the youths in conferences. You resocialize them to where they are socialized. Where are they socialized? You go to Tik Tok.

[00:06:12]Where are they socialized? You go to Facebook. But beyond that, there is need for physical convening. That's why you see us doing things like the youth accountability hangout or we are saying no let's create brave spaces for young people because we are tired of the discourse of safe spaces. The difference between a brave and a safe space is a brave space we go beyond comfort that is central in a safe space and we start to talk about courage. How can we build beyond comfort courage for young people to be able to question power to engage power and hold power to account? That's why we are coming up with these innovative ways where the young people will be chewed but in that kind of you know chilled environment. They're discussing about important intervention as far as you know what we call the center nave of the state is concerned which is public finance. when but when we see that there are so many issues that require um accountability campaigns >> yes >> or movements of some sort um what are your areas of concern >> if you can list them maybe in the order of importance in terms of your focus >> yes >> as an organization >> so our focus area as an organization is you know multi-dimensional in the sense that we focus on three main pillars that We have thought as young people there is need of our structured engagement and intervention. We talk about public finance accountability since this is a movement that is born out of the realization of the gap as far as awareness advocates and following up on auditor general issues is concerned.

[00:08:05]One of our critical pillars thus is public finance accountability. So when you talk about public finance accountability, we talk about public finance you know management, we talk about issues raised by the audently you know the order general you know you know tried to you know to explain to people how the state is being you know looted or how resources are being mis you know appropriated within uh MDA's you know ministry department and agencies and realize that as of May 2025, 40 motor vehicles, 17 fire trucks, 83 desktops, and 75 laptops were unaccounted for. These things were actually paid but unaccounted for. What does it mean? It means either they were actually paid and delivered but they were not delivered to the rightful people. Maybe you know SCVN you know buys you know two good quality cameras then you can't see where they are. Maybe Costa you took one and went with it to Victoria force and start you know using it for personal use. So these are the issues that are happening within the government. You know the order general also speaks about how the treasurer the pay master is you know you know is not following the public finance management act. You realize that about 1.98 billion was paid for directly from the treasurer to you know to service deliveries under you know MDAs but only 1.38 was accounted for 1.38 billion was accounted for you know so which means around 597 you know.7 million >> mhm >> was not accounted for that money it's a lot of man. So where is it going? These are the issues that we are trying to engage on to see how we can have intervention as young people and raise awareness to say no you know there is looting that is happening hookline and singer and it's only young people who can rise up to say no this should end and ask important questions not just receive things that are coming you know from our taxpayers man question where the actual money is going.

[00:10:32]>> Mhm. your vision to be you seem to be very so clear. But I want to maybe understand what the role young people can play in this country in terms of promoting issues of accountability where they will be able to hold public office bureers to account for mismanaging the finances as per your vision.

[00:10:56]So first and foremost I think it starts around the culture. You know Amika Cabra says every revolution is first a cultural revolution. So when you talk about culture we talk about systems thinking. When you talk about systems thinking we talk about how we as young people should be wired in terms of how we think. It's not about us receiving, you know, motor vehicles, receiving aqua money for fuel or this and that. It's about ask asking the real structural changes that are needed because it's not the role of the government to give me a car. The role of the government is to provide opportunities so that I can be able to buy a car for myself. the role of the government. It doesn't make sense for the government to give us you know freebies while if I go to the hospital to parat that is required. If I go to University of Zimbabwe you know there are no enough lecturers for us to be able to rethink about the future because we cannot talk about the future without education. So it's about thinking that way to say let us address the fundamentals. What are the fundamentals? Education. What are the fundamentals? Issues to do with health. What are the fundamentals?

[00:12:15]Issues to do with bread and butter issues within the issues of households.

[00:12:22]Are we able, you know, when we go to school, we're being told that one of the key to success is education. But if you go to school now after you graduate, you know, people are now going outside the country. They're going to South Africa.

[00:12:37]They're going all over. and see what's happening in South Africa you know because our people are not being catered for because we believe that the government is the parent of the society so if the government abrogates its role of making sure that they safeguard us which are the children of the government then we should be able to rise up and question to say no what we do not want are not this you know gift or so forth what we want is for you to address the fundamentals that each and every one of us can be able to benefit. So that's what we are trying to do to make sure that young people start to think in that way and when we talk about the culture we talk about how they think we can actually be able now to knock sense to say no these are the issues that the order general is talking about. Let us raise awareness but let us go beyond awareness you know let us use the areas of engagements that we have let us make sure that the honorable members of parliament that are deployed under the youth you know the youth quarter let us give them a mandate to say each and every witness we want you to ask these particular questions that are holding our future hostage.

[00:13:52]>> Mhm. So I I believe that whatever you're raising it must be existing already in the public. People know but the question will be how do you get young people to get them organized and start to practically hold the office beers to account? Those who are misusing public funds, those are misusing public resources to account. How do you get them organized? Particularly in this era where we see that um there is an avalanche of dishing out of uh freebies uh like cars, cash and >> and so on. This is the generation that is now getting used to this kind of incentives. How do you then get them organized to then hold them to account?

[00:14:39]We're in the era of Gananda. Yeah. So when you talk about everyone knows I think is a misrepresentation to an extent was there actually people who don't know about these things that are happening and we should go beyond knowing was if we go ideological you realize there's a difference between political consciousness and political conscience.

[00:15:06]So political consciousness is that ability of being able to know to say that this man is being looted this and that these motor vehicles were not delivered. But when you talk about political conscience is the aftermath of knowing what to do after you have be able to absorb the information that you have been given. So for us to be able to deal with the issues of the political conscience which is one of your priorities that you are saying how can we make sure that young people are then later engaged you know issues to do with money that you have not yet handled does not make sense. You know when we were young people we thought $100 is a lot of money cuz we were yet to hold it. Now you know $100 you you see that if you try to pay fees doesn't even balance. If you try to do your Iran as far as going to work doesn't balance. So one of the things that we're doing is trying to make these digits make sense to young people. How do they make sense? You relate them to the material needs of them. So for example to say if 597.7 million is unaccounted for what can that money do for you in terms of roads what can that money do for you in terms of hospitals what can it do for you in terms of making sure that if you are at university you're doing sciences research materials are available lecturers are available the system itself is working towards to make sure that we emancipate young people from poverty. So it's about us you know occupying the unconventional spaces for the civil society has been about calling young people to say come and let's gather but we are saying no instead of us saying come and let's gather and reason together we are saying we are coming to where you are and we can reason together there that's why you see us saying you know let us redefine let us start to talk about these issues on Tik Tok and we were very much surprised you know to say that 2.4 people can join. And if you go and listen to that, you know, interview to that discussion we're having, young people were asking critical questions to the honorable member of parliament. And it shows how young people just need to be engaged where they are because you know because of the environment that we are operating in. There is also need for us to be able to make best use of the social media that we have and bring in alternative discourses that can become superior logic within society. That's the only way that we can then be able to absorb, attract and have young people sit down and gather. And it's not a journey that we can give a specific time bound to say we'll be able to achieve this kind of political consciousness after this long. you know the issues that Steve Bleo were addressing as far as fighting a path that was concerned you know it didn't start one day didn't end there right now still you know people are still struggling to have a black identity within Africa and these are issues that he just started so it's about us just getting into the space and contributing to what we can but it goes beyond youth accountability initiative And it requires each and every one of us to be engaged. We just do as little as we can to push the change that we need.

[00:18:47]>> And they have said I'll repeat this. You you have a very clear vision that you you want accountability in terms of the usage of let's say taxes. Yes.

[00:18:57]>> People are paying taxes. We pay license fees to >> wire roads like this.

[00:19:03]>> Yes.

[00:19:04]>> We pay to fees. uh we pay uh ZBC radio license fees but the what we get we're not happy with the service but but the question is the young people you have got a competing incentive >> yes >> from the Gananda discourse where these freebies are being dished out even to young people themselves how do they get involved >> yes >> in these accountability issues because there's a certain quarter of this constituency that is benefiting.

[00:19:36]>> Yes.

[00:19:36]>> Yeah. How do you intend to to compete with that setup at the moment?

[00:19:42]>> So I think I'll go back to what I said in terms of the thought process but beyond that so that I can satisfy you know you as far as answering that is concerned. It's also about showing young people what opportunities can do to them more than being given a car. It doesn't make sense for me to be given a car right now if I cannot be able to sustain basic issues like now dealing with fuel.

[00:20:14]I was at University of Zimbabwe studied data science and systems. So now when for example you are now working you know and you are given a car which after the exchange of the car you cannot be able to buy fuel. A car cannot be able to sustain the family that young people are you know dreaming of starting. A car cannot buy basic you know things that are required within your household. What can give you all those things is number one a structured intervention that is around opportunities. So we are saying no you know your thought process should not be about the now as young people but now I have a car what about in the moment whereby you know the car is now wanting to take from me's car has expensive you know expenses that are related to it fuel so many things material you can you know talk about all the things that you want and it's not everyone by the way you have been given that car and you realize that you No opportunities should not come in that you know kind of manner. It doesn't mean that those who have been given those cars are the most hardworking within society. Most probably no. So we are saying no you know this just a pool of young people.

[00:21:40]So what they will do they will attract you and lure you to say no if you see that it is the influence that they >> that they hold then which becomes a question >> in terms of motivating others like for example give you someone who is um a comedian >> is given a car is got a commanding large following of of young people there. So yes, it could be one or two people who might have been given and you on the face of it there is no huge effect. But anyway, let's also go beyond just this narrative on the Ghanaian motivating young people to be part in being able to hold um office beers who misapp youth accountability initiative. What is your appreciation of the value >> that the citizens are getting uh out of the taxes >> cocktail of taxes that they are paying >> in today's Zimbabwe?

[00:22:44]>> Mhm.

[00:22:45]>> So you know it's a very sad issue that we were talking about. We recently had a youth accountability initiative and we were doing what we were calling a youth accountability hangout. We're doing what we're calling an accountability cafe affair. So can cafe had three you know tables that were focusing on different issues and one of the issues were issues around text and young people the issues to do with you know when we go and buy chicken slice you know there's first of all text that is you know taken when you you you buy your fuel this and that there's carbon tax you top off when we do simple transactions of sending to your girlfriend you know $10 way is there to take their MT text when you want to do the in drive things. You know they taking you taking digital tax if you talk about Netflix everywhere that you go the government is taking the money and we understand that government sustains itself through the taxpayers money but the aftermath of it that is what we are questioning. We are not saying don't tax us. We are saying if you takes us then you should you know account because that's the concept of social contract cost to say that relationship between the government and you know the governors is around how we give them power because the government at our mercy was the money that you know they are using the government coffers coming from the taxes of you know citizens you know in general and young people in specific. So we are saying you know when there is fast food takes that is supposed to go and buy you know cancer machines we should be able to see those cancer machines in place. If you are you know people are paying targets if you are paying taxes what's happening with our roads is it not the money that is coming back to us as gifts. But as youth initiative, what is so upset?

[00:24:48]Maybe if you can just list two and the justifications terms of the taxes with no value. So if if if we go to first text which is the text fast food tax was when because these are a bunch of you know is another term called sin taxes which are taxes that are taken from people so that we can be able to take care you know of of the diseases that come with eating fast food tax. If it's about smoking, there's a text that comes so that we can deal with the diseases that come with that. But if you see the fast food tax which is 1% you know that is taken but you know more than 5 million was raised you know during the last quarter but you know where are the cancer machines if you go to you know you can't get those. So it means that there is mismanagement or there is you know unclear information to say actually is this text supposed you know to be taken and be used for this kind of particular matter. And when we talk about that we also talk of the IMT you know tax intermediated money transfer tax. Why is it that? Because as young people we make transactions and when we make transactions IMT is making every small transaction expensive when you want to buy anything you want to buy something online using echo cash was nowadays most of our money is now mobile money that's when you that's why you even see that even at this conference you know people were calling the ruling party were calling to ruling to say no should get rid of this 2% tax why is it the austerity measures you know we are still doing the austerity for prosperity now after how long has been the minister of finance so these are some of the two taxes that we think and obviously you know the increase in terms of deposit affects everyone so you cannot basic basic economics you cannot tax you know people out of poverty what you need to do is to industrialize so that is the main issues which when we have time we talk about our other pillow natural resources on how we can domestically mobilize resources apart from taxes how we can start to talk about value retention value addition and beneficiation of our minerals you talk of lithium talk of gold and you know the Chinese influx that has been happening in Zimbabwe >> and there's youth accountability initiatives do you think maybe the Zimbabwe youth the Zimbabw people do you even appre appreciation of the effect of these taxes and uh the service of value that they should be getting out. Is there that awareness in terms of your engagements?

[00:27:44]>> So in terms of engagement there is less awareness as far as how you know these taxes are detrimental. Why am I saying so? when you go and buy costa to chicken in they've already put a blanket you know cost to say this chicken slices for $5 and so forth. So when you buy it's you know if you want to hide something of you know anything generally from people put it in writing or in a book. So no one really you know starts reading the receipt to say this is for $5 but about dollar is going for taxes. So the difference with other societies if you go to America you be told that you know this camera cost it costs around 2,000 but when you want to pay they say you are now paying 2.5. Then you ask yourself you know where's the 500 coming from? they will tell you that it's a tax. So there is a hard realization in that kind of system and the system that we have which automatically deducts tax.

[00:28:56]Sometimes it misleads people into thinking that this is the actual cost of the product. So this is now our role to make sure that we break these things down so people you know get to understand. We're working on a campaign where young people should be able to go and buy you know their first foods and you know post to say you know this is the actual cost but you know this amount is going to taxes and after we have that awareness of how much we are paying we can then be able to equate to say is what we are paying equal to the saves that we are getting. So it's around the way that tax is deducted. If we talk of pay and income tax, you realize that you know if you are getting around $900 and you are in a certain tax bracket already it's deducted already before we are given. But in other countries cost you're given the 900 if you have to remit 200 you then remove 200 and give back to the government. So that process alone gives you a better appreciation to say I'm actually paying the government.

[00:30:03]So it's about us trying to educate people for them to see beyond what they start to read through these things.

[00:30:12]>> Mhm.

[00:30:13]>> And and let's let's look at maybe another critical area. I think you have explained in detail in terms of the effect and the awareness of the taxation in this in this country. Let's move a bit to issues of corruption.

[00:30:26]>> It's one of the things that has been recorded to be so rampant. Mhm.

[00:30:29]>> Um how are the young people affected in your view >> as the y >> so I think of course the issues to do with corruption it's a national crisis if not an African crisis of the way that we talked about you know the way that you think before we even talk about those in government between the two of us cost you know in your everyday way of life. How corrupt are you with the little resources that are available to you? How corrupt are you? Before we talk about how this big money is being, you know, spent within the government, you know, even if you talk of the councils, if you talk of, you know, those who call themselves alternatives, if you talk of the ruling party everywhere, so it's something, you know, it's a virus within society. And we go back to Amiga Cabra. Every revolution is first, you know, a cultural revolution. Let's start by, you know, redefining how we think. Are you able to say we drive?

[00:31:47]Are you able to say?

[00:31:54]So these are So it's a cultural thing that we should be able to deal with. But going back you know to the broader canvas of how within government you know these things are operating. It's also a lack of systems post you know systems to do with checks and balances whereby you know the parliament that is supposed to act as an oversight to the executive is sometimes captured you know so it's very hard for them to ask questions and them themselves you know they recently they received 40,000s as loans but do you even know the repayment you know details as far as to say how do they repay that? Did anyone repay that 40,000? No. And we expect those people to give an oversight. They'll be asking anyway just remember we gave you 40,000 as loans. So all those things you know it's so it's it's a very complex and it needs to start from the bottom up for us to you know I think it needs people like Mao you know and people who are who are so I don't want to >> but maybe to be more specific what do what does the young person suffer in Zimbabwe within with that kind of system culture the levels of corruption as you're explaining them what does the young person >> so you know we recently have youth hang out and there is someone who did a good poem was doing poetry he said you know young people of benefit much if the h would value what I know more than who I know so that's where young people are also affected to say you know when You finish your A levels, you finish your degrees, then you want to get a job. Sometimes not the best are getting the jobs that are available.

[00:34:05]Why? Because it's always about who you know.

[00:34:06]>> So the competent young people are being deprived of the opportunities to >> to release their potentials.

[00:34:14]>> That's why you see them going to America. That's why you see them in corruption. You know, you know if you go if you go to to Ashton Park, there is a road that was being constructed drive.

[00:34:28]Look how it it is now. It's a dusty road. The other road is beside. So these are the things that affects our daily life. You know even if you see the you know structure of our roads you realize that the accidents some that are happening you know others it's because of maybe how people are driving but most of them are being driven you know if you go outside South Africa not not somewhere cool go to South Africa you see the quality of roads that they have and all those things you know they affect young people in terms of how we generally live >> and what is the young person within the youth accountability initiative going to do >> with these challenges.

[00:35:16]>> Yes.

[00:35:17]>> So I think you know ultimately it's around you know making sure that people act number one in a way knowing that they have a role to play within society.

[00:35:32]So what we have to do as young people is to ask critical questions. What we have to do as young people is to be is to move beyond asking and start engaging.

[00:35:43]Move beyond engaging and start holding those into power account. You know would say you know you know I'm not a liberator. There are no liberators.

[00:35:53]People liberate themselves about individuals.

[00:35:55]>> You seem to love this scholar. You know it's about these individuals you know that should be able to say I am you know my own savior how is you how are you your own savior it starts you know small as a young person are you part of the person who is feeding into you know society assignment and so forth. These are the basic things you know that young people should. But as youth accountability initiative about now creating a movement of young people that can be able to speak up a movement of political young people but nan partisan young people to say this not about that part this part it's about Texas it's not about that part about this part it's about health care system not about that part or this part it's about how as young people we are being deprived of opportunities that we are now going outside and being treated You know like slaves in other countries or at least we have a country in a continent that we call ours which have vast resources that should just be effectively used and translated into material innermost aspirations of >> you spoke about how distinct your organization is. Um just wondering the influence that the young people would have graduated or who have been benefited would have benefited >> from your services of awareness and and so forth are going to exert the influence in terms of fighting >> the corruption.

[00:37:49]>> Yeah. Which has been described as a couch as a I mean it has earned so many titles and names >> in this country. Yeah.

[00:37:59]So in terms of you know the influence that you know people that pass through the youth accountability initiative is concerned you know recently we we just scrolling on Tik Tok then I saw one of you know you know a young lady who came to our activities you know she went to South Africa to Cape Town then she was just you know taking videos taking how she just went into a hospital. She booked for a doctor. She got, you know, the medicine that she wanted without paying anything. And she's someone with just a passport. She's not asked to, you know, many questions. After that, she's going to a mall. She's actually shocked that, you know, things that we call mo in Zimbabwe Costa. If you go to other countries, if you go to K Mall, Century Mo, if you know the actual mos, go to other countries. These are the things that young people should you know should should should start to envy. So that's some of the influence that we are doing. So young people are waking up to say no when I'm exposed to something you know I relate these things to the things that we were discussing and debating about to say no we should be able to start asking questions of the government or some other countries are doing it >> why can't we did it too >> we look at how corruption is embedded in various systems providers if you Um if you go to a driving school right now, if you go to >> um V where people would want to get their licenses and so on >> and and the young the most of the people who will be requiring such services are the young people.

[00:39:52]>> How the question then will be the influence that the young people can put in fighting this corruption >> because you also have to understand the Gen Z culture and tradition. They want things at a faster pace. Don't no patience, no what. Just pay 10 bucks and go. If you don't want to pay, you might wait six hours, four hours and so on.

[00:40:14]>> These are the people that you seek to change their mindset.

[00:40:18]>> And this is a challenge that is before your organization. M >> and it's not you know it's not an easy answer and an easy task >> cuz it's not a onefold kind of strategy cuz we are talking about you know individuals we are talking about the systems and we don't live in isolation you know we live within a system and as you are saying there are some of the things that you will say without paying But we are just trying to give an alternative thought to say you know where you know where you can you know why we are trying to solve this grand you know corruption that is within the system where you can start by embedding a culture of holding yourself to account where you can these small things sometimes not about you know dreaming too big to say in two years we want to make sure that you know no one is misallocating funds no one is taking few coupons if it's parliament without the approval of the treasurer as the order general who do I sometimes it's about starting small as young people to say how do we you know organize ourselves and start to not make it fashionable for me those simple ideas of being patient as we are saying I think we that's when we can be able to start fighting the issues to do with corruption let us start to rethink our you know way of doing things a society. The the the question will be what is the price for holding myself with integrity in as far as uh all these menaces that we are discussing are concerned corruption not being not being involved in accountability issues. What is the price for that for being um maintaining integrity in my interaction with these institutions where I will be going wanting services? If I get stopped driving along along the road by the police, um, shouldn't I just give them $2? What is the incentive >> for holding myself with integrity as a young person in this country?

[00:43:07]>> So, you know, it's it's it's an actually a good question and a challenging one >> to say, you know, as young people, then what is it for me to be able to abide with these rules or at least the whole system is broken down? But if everyone would have said that we couldn't have attained independence right now. If everything could have said that Nelson Mandela would have just left everything that they were doing with the NC with Panaffrican Congress to say no others are you know actually joining the Apad police. So why should we why should we sacrifice ourselves for this? But it's those small steps in terms of changing you know the culture at a you know at a small level that can cate that can you know cascade up to us changing the system at large because you know the system is vicious because what you're trying to do is sometimes it's about you know there is someone who said if a leader rules a country long enough the character of the leader eventually becomes the character of society. So we want to reach an extent where by co if a young person is going to wake up one day saying I want to be a member of parliament you know if we started it's small you know the reason why you know even the feminist movement is saying let us c them young abusive this and that let us know being a man doesn't mean you have to be toxic being a man doesn't mean that we have to exert violence. Being a man doesn't mean that you deploy your masculinity to resolve conflict.

[00:45:04]>> That's the things that we are trying to do to say no it might be hard for me to wake up and change the manners of all the members of parliament.

[00:45:12]>> What is your response? You are into the communities. you're in the communities and you're doing your engagements and there comes a question from a young person who says what is even the purpose for me >> to enroll for a program at your university >> when I'm seeing someone >> who is not seen even the doors of a university or whose levels of education are still questionable >> but is able to get tenders >> that are worth millions of dollars why should I waste my time in school when you've got people who can just get tenders they get rich overnight.

[00:45:46]>> Um, how would you respond to such a question? Such a person who is who is not even seeing the value of going to school because he's seeing other people who have not gone to school or who have questionable educational levels getting or awarded tenders worth of millions of dollars. These are the questions coming from the youth in your communities.

[00:46:05]>> Yes. And these are the question that are coming. But we are also in terms of response you know there is a skewed way of thinking to think that education is the key to making you know a living. We should start by challenging that cost to say going to invest it doesn't mean that we going there to unlock because if you go back to the structure of the education that we are dealing with right now Costa you realize that we are getting educated for us to go and work as an accountant somewhere to go and work as a lawyer to go and work as a doctor but we have done a little as far as harnessing what an individual you know himself or herself you know has his gift if you go to other countries because of vast of the opportunities that are being created through innovations people I've met so many brilliant young people you know someone who came to our account who is running a tech you know startup realized that this person did not even pass through invested I don't but it took you know himself to say no I want to learn about coding. I want to do this. So first in responding your answer going to university is not the key to making money. It's not the key to living a life. Living a life should come through hard work should come you know through being able to translate your skills into producing something cost there is no substitute to production. If you want to make a living, you should be able to produce. Be it hard goods, be it agriculture, be it providing services.

[00:47:49]So that's the first thing that we should talk about. But answering the second question around you know the second part of the answer around the issues to say no why should I then as I was speaking someone would ask why should I then be able to be a hard worker be able to have those skills while is there someone who's just getting tender if you realize number one that one thing that I would say it's not everyone who is getting you know money through that so it's it's not like you're going to with that person.

[00:48:23]So you have to understand that you should have your way of working and getting the money and also it's about authentic way of living that we should embrace as young people. Are you not proud to be people like Elon Musk? We can differ in terms of you know political ideology and the way that he wants to organize society but are you not proud by someone who creates those things? Are you not proud of being strive? You are a person who know actually worked.

[00:48:54]>> Are you not proud of being dangot? You only just proud of being that person that we all know. No, you can't be proud of that.

[00:49:02]>> Yeah. The danger is the these are the role models for the young people and and you are dealing with young constituents that is looking for looking to I saw something on social media where a very young person was saying when I grow up I want to be like this person and that person is associated with cutting corners >> doesn't really follow the proper route of you know getting money and so on. This has become a role model to young people and this is what you're dealing with. So I don't want to us to be on a slippery slope whereby we also using what others can call of composition to say what's true to one is true to all because if we try to go that road we cannot sanctify the whole society.

[00:49:46]>> But most of the young people you know that we sometimes interact with the young people that actually need opportunities for them to be able to work for themselves. There are very few and if you even see those young people that are supporting you know those narratives of giving cars and so forth.

[00:50:06]If you look at those young people and you sit with them down deep down their innermost aspirations is not to get a car. Their innermost aspirations is to be able to get a car for themselves through opportunities. So I don't know which statistical representation are we using to say that young people are inspired. You know let us not confuse desperation and you know the actual way that young people think.

[00:50:40]There is no young person who who is inspired by that kind of you know behavior but because of desperation then you know just say because the material conditions are are the ones that can also determine the way that we think but does the way that we act but doesn't really say about the way that we think and the way that we feel. So let us not confuse the two.

[00:51:06]>> We've spoken at length.

[00:51:08]>> I would want us to conclude this conversation you by telling or advising young people in terms of how they should carry themselves >> in as far as preserving integrity is concerned. shying away from corruption, shying away from freebies and incentives and maintaining integrity and also develop the skills of holding these office beers to account. What skills they need? Just give them a word of advice.

[00:51:39]>> Okay. I think first and foremost it starts with the culture with thinking as young people. Let us not think in partisan way. Let us think in a political way. What do we mean? It's not about political parties. It's not about that part or this part. It's about addressing the material realities that we are facing as young people, questioning those in power, questioning, you know, those in politics without looking at which side. If corruption is done by this party should be named as it is. If it's done by the other party, it should be named as it is. That's how we can be able to build societies and to young people. It's about working hard in those small spaces that we occupy. You know, I was listening this other day.

[00:52:28]You know, I was reading this other book of Michelle Obama, the light we can. And you he said, you know, sometimes it's not about having those big dreams of saying I want to be the president. I want to change this country to make sure that we all have roads. Sometimes about the immediate successes that we can have as young person. If you are can all level the immediate success that you should focus on is just holding yourself with integrity finishing your level and you know having good grades can a level that's the same can be invested that the same but cannot go toward that path that is the traditional and probably not the most effective way of working making money. You can go the other way of enhancing your skills, of tapping into your gifts, exerting hard work towards the realization of what you need as young people and beyond and above. Young people should read for you to be able to have the political consciousness. for you to be able to maneuver life as it is. There is the need for young people to read whatsoever that you are reading but actually be able to be in a position of reading. We've been you know traumatized by these Tik Toks. been traumatized by the social media. But there is something that comes with reading hard books that comes with reading good content that can be able to maneuver within this broken society which ultimately needs us to be able to revamp it into something that we want.

[00:54:06]The question of the young people, how they should arise and uh hold um public office beers to account. Questioning the usage of their taxes, questioning how resources are being distributed in this country. Where is our gold? What is it doing to our lives? What is happening to our diamonds? what is happening to um um um um in terms of everything the resources that we gather that are gathered that are collected uh by various agencies, Zimbra, Zinara and so forth. This is the message that is coming from the youth accountability initiative and is saying that every young person in this country must arise, must awake, must open their eyes and must ask questions that matter. Thank you so much for watching. Thank you so much for continuously following us and thank you so much for sharing uh this very important episode to other colleagues, friends locally, internationally, abroad. Thank you very much. Until next time, I'm signing out.