Local government leadership requires balancing political representation with practical service delivery, where elected officials must prioritize community needs over political considerations and work collaboratively across party lines to address complex infrastructure and social challenges facing their constituents.
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Suffolk County Council, County Council - 21 May 2026Añadido:
Good afternoon.
I would like to welcome you all to today's meeting of Suffach County Council and congratulations to all councilors, new and returning, on your election.
My name is Jessica Fleming. I'm chairman of the county council and I will be opening today's meeting to the point when council is invited to elect a new chairman for the 202627 municipal year. That is at agenda item six.
Today's meeting is being broadcast live is available to watch on the council's website whilst we're in public session.
A recording will also be available for viewing following the meeting.
Members of the public and the press may also record, film, or brook broadcast this meeting when the public and press are not lawfully excluded in line with the council's published guidance, provided that due courtesy and respect are shown to others in attendance.
Can I remind speakers to wait to be invited to speak before turning on your microphone.
Please indicate that you wish to speak by raising your hand and waiting for confirmation from the moni monitoring officer Nigel Inis on my left.
When you are speaking, please ensure you use the microphone and speak directly into it so that you can be clearly heard on the audio recording and the website.
Please avoid holding papers or IIT equip equipment in front of the microphone as this affects sound quality. I would also please ask you to avoid talking with colleagues while speakers are addressing the chamber.
We are not anticipating any emergencies this afternoon. Please familiarize yourself with the fire escapes and listen for any instructions in the event of an emergency. At the end of today's meeting, the chairman will request that councilors remain seated until you hear the gavvel to confirm that the meeting has closed. And finally, may I remind you all to turn your mobile phones, laptops, and any other IT equipment to silent if you have not already done so.
The first item on today's agenda is suffic in focus.
I am delighted to welcome the very Reverend Joe Horse, Dean of St. Edmundsbury Cathedral.
Born in 1965 and brought up in London, Dean Joe studied at Durham University and trained for the priesthood in Oxford. He served his curacy in Clappam.
Incumbencies followed in Barnes, developing in ministry with young families, restoring the church and building a community center, and Fulham, a busy parish church, civic profile, and lots of pastoral offices.
Dean Joe took an MA in theology and politics in 2015, and to help him be a dean, a couple of mini MBAs in 2017 and 2021.
In July 2018, Gene Joe was installed as dean of St. Edmundsbury and oversees the spiritual and administrative life of the cathedral community.
He serves on the general sinnate representing the deans and is a trustee of the United Society partners in the gospel. When not being clerical, Dean Joe loves hiking. Camino de Santiago in 2016, gardening, cooking, theater, and scuba diving.
Counselors, it gives me very great pleasure to ask Dean Joe to address you all. Over to you, Dean.
Thank you, Madam Chairman, for that warm welcome. I am grateful indeed to have this opportunity to share a reflection or two on our collective duty of service to the people of this wonderful county.
And in so doing, I'm honored to be among the first to offer warm congratulations to councilors on your election or your reelection.
As you all know so well, and some of you personally, faith plays an important and significant role in the life and well-being of Suffukk. We're firmly embedded in all communities and all aspects of urban and rural life. Like you, we serve and nurture diverse communities, and I hope together we will continue to work in our common purpose.
Our wonderful new bishop, Joanne Grenfall, made her maiden speech in the House of Lords last Monday. She began by reflecting on her pre-ordination academic research into the 16th century poet Edmund Spencer. Spencer was preoccupied with the idea of the common good in Elizabeth in England. And Joanne asked the question, "What might the common good look like today?"
Did the common good, I wonder, play a conscious part in your reason for standing in local elections?
And if the common good did play that part, then what would you understand the common good to look like today in Suffukk? What might the qualities of the common good be? Why might it matter? Is it under threat?
If the common good constitutes everything from policies, ethics, the social contract itself, which taken together will benefit the most people in any one given moment of history in a county. Then it seems to me a couple of questions for you to reflect upon might occur.
Imagine that you have a sort of spiritual psychological backpack on your back with which you need to arm yourself for the next few years ahead.
What might you put into that backpack that constitutes the virtues of the common good that will help you best serve the people of Suffukk?
Serving the most vulnerable, treating people equally, setting an example of loving service, bringing the best interests of our diverse county together, ensuring that no one's left behind, challenging any narratives of fear and hatred, because working together, I'd suggest that we're all going to need those virtues of the common good more than ever over the next few years. And I think you know why. Because there's an increasing consensus that the ties of that common good that bind us together are fraying.
Public perception of politics demonstrates that many in the electorate are disconnected or skeptical about the ability of hardworking politicians to get to grips with many of the key issues that face us in daily life. And that skepticism has led to an increasing disconnect between politicians and the electorate. You may already have heard it on the doorsteps.
I was naively astonished the other day that our MP in Berry St. Edmonds, like other MPs, habitually needs a bodyguard.
We've become increasingly impatient as a nation and as a western hemisphere in an age of instant gratification, online convenience, same day deliveries.
We have become impatient with having to wait and more impatient with having to set aside our own imperatives or our own our own preferences in order that someone might have to be served ahead of us. And yet wait, we must we must continue to wait on NHS waiting lists for housing for the age when we can retire and we're not happy about it as a nation and a county and we tend to blame our politicians.
Have we become ungovernable?
Four prime ministers in four years. The very nature of how we do politics is changing. There's a lack in institutions across the board. There's uncertainty here about how local and regional government will serve us in the future.
All against the backdrop of an increasing sense of unease and fragmentation in our national conversation.
So if I say this is an exciting opportunity for you on the front line of local government, I might be met by a hollow laugh because you are tasked with delivering the common good in Suffukk in a profoundly challenging psychosocial context.
And in an environment where policy delivery is becoming increasingly performative, reality can have a nasty tendency to bite.
So I get it. The task ahead of you is enormous.
But but in building and securing trust and confidence, we all know that the people of Suffukk have qualities that are about generosity and quiet loyalty and openness. Once you've earned the trust of the people of Suffukk, it's not easily lost, but it's perhaps not wise to take the patience of the people of Suffukk for granted.
Now, faith groups are determinately non-political and we have to be mindful of the delicate boundaries we tread. But if I can offer just three very brief observations and you may already be familiar with them. I think you know you'll be under keen observation more so given the universal reach of the media.
Might I gently suggest that the people of Suffukk will be more impressed if they can see genuine collaborative efforts to work across political divides to deliver measurable benefits in a time of economic hardship for many.
They'll be more impressed with working across the divides than in throwing things at each other across boundaries.
Secondly, knowing how much the common good probably still matters, however afraid, can this new council start as it means to go on with care and compassion and positive action. We may be less of a Christian observant country nowadays, but we remain a country founded on the PR principles of Christendom.
Christrysendom has questions about who is my neighbor? What do I owe them?
These are foundational to the common good and to a social contract under threat.
And lastly, I invite everyone sitting in this chamber today genuinely to commit to listen to the better angels of our inner nature.
Resisting the scoring of points for political advantage.
Thinking always of the constituents who rely most upon you. the poor, the vulnerable, the older, the younger, the marginalized, and the outsider. Because these two are the virtues of Christendom, and they're no less relevant today than they were when the carpenter's son proclaimed them on a Judian hillside over 2,000 years ago.
If those fabled suffuk qualities of quiet resilience, decency, loyalty, modesty really are true, then we're all going to need them over the next few years of a stormy political, social, environmental landscape.
Let Suffukk reflect those good qualities in its political leaders, public servants, humble in service, working for the common good. And I will make a start by saying that I and other faith leaders across Suffukk wish you every success in the challenges and opportunities you face. We are here to support you and we will be praying for you cuz I think you're going to need it.
Thank you.
Dean Joe, thank you so much.
Thank you for your thoughts and your provoking address and for joining us this afternoon. You're very welcome to stay with us and I'm very glad to see you've taken a seat in the gallery.
Please feel free to leave when you choose.
We will now move on to agenda item two, chairman's announcements.
I have no formal announcements for today's meeting.
So, we will move on now to agenda item three. Apologies for absence.
Apologies received in advance are displayed on the screen. No apologies have been received. Does anyone have any further apologies for noting?
Thank you. Let us move on to agenda item four, declarations of interest and dispensations.
I would like to remind you that all members of the council have received written notification from the monitoring officer confirming they have been granted a standing dispensation for a period of four years to allow them to speak or vote on matters relating to devolution and local government reorganization.
Do councilors have any other interests to declare in respect of today's agenda?
I don't see anyone's hand. Thank you.
Let us move on to agenda item five, which is the minutes of the previous meeting.
If any councelor who was present at that meeting wishes to comment on the accuracy of the minutes, please indicate to the monitoring officer that you wish to speak.
If there are no comments, I will take it that council is content to approve the minutes as a correct record. Thank you councilors.
Let us now move on to agenda item six, the election of chairman.
Following the election of the new chairman, he or she will make the declaration of acceptance of office.
But before then I am going to say a few words as chairman as outgoing chairman about my last year.
Being chairman of this council has been an enormous privilege. I've enjoyed every minute of the various civic events. I've met wonderful and interesting people. And I've even enjoyed chairing council meetings.
There's something to be said for the occasional drama. It keeps everyone awake for a start. Um, yeah, please don't go to sleep, councelor Stringer.
Don't go to sleep on me now. Um, meetings should not be dull. That would be the worst outcome of all. And looking around the room, I'm confident that future meetings here will be interesting.
There are so many people whom I owe thanks.
naming anyone risks omission, but a couple of exceptions.
Um, officer Sue Bennett, executive assistant to the left tenency and chairman who has helped organize and fund raise with me. Collectively, I thank Democratic services for their unfailing support and good humor.
I remember and thank in absentia chief executive Nicola Beachch and Nigel Lennis monitoring officer and the many other supporting officers and people. Thank you for your involvement over the years about my two charities and smart.
You are not alone. Jana is a mainly rural agricultural charity focusing on mental health and the reasons of my support should be obvious. Farmers are undergoing more financial and ex existential pressures now than ever before.
The implications have been brought home to me through my contacts with rural charities, through my friends, and as evidenced by continuing tractor runs to and fro London and around the country and gatherings that are happening nationwide. Farmers do not give up easily, but Jana and other rural charities offer hope and a vital helping hand.
My other charity is SMART, Suffukk Music and Arts Alumni Trust.
SMARTT is there to help young people who love music to fulfill their dreams. It offers financial support and performing opportunities and benefits from the involvement of its alumni and support from the Suffach Music Program.
Over the year, a total of £6,535 has been raised through events, donations, and from the wonderful gift fairs that have been held in Dev House.
And this will be distributed to the two charities in due course.
My first event as chairman was at Houston Hall at the kind of invitation of Lady Clare Houston and her family.
Lady Clare has given me invaluable support over the year for which I am immensely grateful.
where we had trailer rides and a tour of the art gallery and gardens, a fundraising raffle and reception. My second main event last year was the annual reception at Trinity Park Ipsswitch thanks to Suffukk Agricultural Association for donating the venue and where smart musicians provided musical entertainment.
Over the year I was privileged to meet royalty, King Charles and Queen Camila in New Market and Princess Anne in Lowto. I visited all three Suffukk RAF bases including the two operated by the USAF.
I intended attended citizenship ceremonies, awards for enterprise, charities and volunteering work and learned about some very impressive businesses that are thriving here in Suffukk.
I visited the eastern education group in Berry including West Suffuk College and Abigate six form and I saw firsthand the magic of learning both practical skills at carpentry building etc hands-on and cutting edge IT births based virtual technologies such as you would see in a James Bond film. Also I've been a frequent attendee at services in various churches and cathedrals including Berry St. Edmunds.
One of my most recent engagements I'm going to mention so bear with me.
This was a meeting in New Market, the case for New Market at the horse racing museum where prominent leaders in this nationally important industry gathered and I tell you about this as an example.
What was said there was important. The racing industry does not operate in isolation as neither do most significant industries and businesses. It is linked with others such as the British Racing School, the training of veterinarians and research into contagious animal diseases.
At Rossdale's Ecquin Hospital, horses are sent for complex treatment from all over the world. It is also the headquarters for the British Veterary Association.
Sadly, Cambridge Reason University recently lost its veterary training school. Very unfortunate and a bit of a blow to the practical and mentoring aspects of the veterary profession.
I'll also mention friery shoeing an essential skill, but more young apprentice friers are needed.
Economically, New Markets racing industry brings overseas investment to the UK. It fosters good relations with other nations, for instance, Ireland.
Important and provides a wide variety of employment opportunities. However, there are threats to its future most critically from land use change in the hinterland.
that is from largecale solar farms, poorly cited and overscaled housing projects and from the rumored new so-called forest city.
In conclusion, there's a lot going on in Suffukk behind the scenes. A lot of inspiring stories of skill and enterprise initi in initiatives to improve educational standards, encourage satisfying jobs and prosperity. They're all there in our county, but they need to be nurtured and valued. And to the next administration, I would ask you to look after this county and look after the countryside.
Support enterprising individuals and businesses. Let them go and they will thrive.
The civic side of life is very important and runs along somewhat seamlessly and independently from the travailes of local government. And long may that last. Thank you and the best of luck to everybody.
Um before I ask for nomination, yes. Do I have any nominations for the chairman of the council for 2026 27, please?
Councelor Hler.
>> Uh Madame Chairman, it gives me great pleasure to propose Louie Bassut as the next chairman of Suffuk County Council.
A longstanding and wellrespected champion of all things Mildenh Hall, Louie has made his political passion to promote the importance of local community, clear and transparent decision-making, and a strong commitment to getting things done on the ground for the people and the communities he has served over the years. He is no stranger to this chamber, having previously served as vice chairman of the council from October 2020. He has also heard roles as vice chairman of the audit committee, sat on the education, transport appeals, and served as deputy cabinet member for highways. He therefore understands well the council's customs and how everything works. He will also be an excellent representative of every counselor in this chamber at civic events across the country in the year ahead. I'm confident he will carry out the role with fairness and good judgment, following in your footsteps, madam chairman, and keeping us all in good order. I commend councelor Pursuit to the council. Thank you.
>> You very much councelor Hedwin. Do I have a seconder please?
Councelor Faircloth Mutton.
>> Thank you madame chairman. Uh it it is great honor to second councelor Bassutil as vice chairman of the council in the year 2026 2027. uh as councelor Hadwin has rightly said he has the experience of previously being vice chairman and he will be an excellent ambassador for suff going forward. I know councelor Bassil in a teamwork capacity he is somebody who is uh deeply humble and incredibly helpful and I know that that will be welcomed incredibly uh by all residents in Suffukk and indeed outside of Suffach in all of his duties. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Are there any other nominations?
I don't see any. Is it the wish of council to agree the nomination by general affirmation?
>> Good. Then I am pleased to announce that councelor Louie Busito is duly elected chairman of Suffuk County Council for the municipal year 2026 to 27.
Congratulations, Councelor Bisito.
I will now present you with the badge of office.
I, Louisie Bassutil, having been elected to the office of chairman of the council, hereby declare that I take upon that office upon myself and will duly and faithfully fulfilled the duties of it according to the best of my judgment and my ability. I undertake to be guided by the councelor's code of conduct in the performance of my functions in that office.
Thank you councilors for uh placing your trust in me today. It is a great honor to be confirmed as chairman of Suffach County Council and I am proud to take on this role in the service of the council and the people of Suffukk. I am very grateful to everyone who has supported me and uh in particular to Michael Hadwin and Philip Fairclothmutton for their kind words. I'd first like to pay tribute to our outgoing chairman, councelor Jessica Fleming, and our vice chairman David Roach, for the commitment and dedication that they have shown over the past 12 months. As we have heard, councelor Fleming has represented this council with distinction across the county at civic, community, and business events, giving so generously of her time. I would also like to congratulate her on the ex outstanding work that she has done in raising both funds and awareness for her chosen charities and smart. And I'm delighted that the events held in support of them were such a success.
In addition, I'd like to thank both Councelor Fleming and David Roach for their many years of service to the communities as councilors as they now retire from that chapter of public life.
I'm very much looking forward to the year ahead both in chairing our council meetings and in serving as the council's civic representative. It will be a p a privilege to meet and engage with so many people and communities across Suffukk including council staff, local businesses and charities and to learn more about the many strengths and achievements of our country county. I already know the year ahead will be a busy and rewarding one as the diary is beginning to fill very quickly.
Finally, it is one of the great privileges of this office to nominate a charity to support during the year. And I'm pleased to say that my chosen charity will be the Suffukk Accident Rescue Service, SS.
They're an extraordinary group of volunteers who work alongside the East of England Ambulance Service, providing enhanced medical care at the scene of serious accidents before a patient reaches hospital. They do remarkable work and I look forward to sharing more about their contribution and the support they provide at future meetings.
Before I move on to agenda item seven, uh, David Roach, do do you want to say a few words?
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Congratulations on exceeding to the office of chair. Um, break with the convention. Chairman, vice chairman don't normally get this, but I just like to say a big thank you to everybody in the council from officers, staff, and fellow members for the last nine years. It's been a privilege. It's been an honor. I wish you all the very, very best in your endeavors in looking after our great county. Thank you.
>> Mr. Chairman, may I make a point of order? Uh, if I may. Apologies, I didn't do this under the relevant item because I didn't know the charity you were going to designate for the year. Uh, but I just need to declare my interest as chair of the trustees of Suffuk Accident Rescue Service. and thank you very much for your support. Very kind.
>> My pleasure. I look forward to working with you.
>> Agenda item seven is the election of vice chairman. Following the election, the new vice chairman will make the declaration of acceptance of office. Do I have any nominations for the vice chairman of the of the council for 2026 to 27, please?
Councelor Faircloth Martin.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and congratulations on your elevation to high office. Uh, I would like to nominate Councelor Kerry Turner for the position of vice chairman in the municipal year.
I've come to know Carrie uh very well in the last few months. I was her agent in the recent elections. Uh, during that time, I've learned much about Kerry.
Like many people in Suffuk, Carrie is a self-employed um small business owner um with refrigeration units along with her family. I think that knowledge and that unique background is something which will go down incredibly well in Suffukk in the coming year. Uh during the time that I've worked with Kerry, she has a fantastic listening skill and I observe that on the ground with residents and indeed um in her own division and also in other divisions being the team player that Kerry is, she is somebody that goes out and help others, not just expect people to help her. So in the coming year, uh I believe that council Turner will be an excellent ambassador in accompanying you in your civic duties and I very much hope that she will be supported in unonymity today. Thank you.
>> Thank you.
>> Do I have a second, please?
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'm very happy to second the nomination of councelor Turner as vice chairman of the council.
I first met councelor Turner about two years ago at a training session led by councelor Hedwin. Uh since then we have worked together, campaigned together and she has become a good and trusted friend. She will be a diligent and conscientious vice chair. Thank you.
>> Thank you very much councelor.
Are there any other nominations?
Is it the wish of the council to agree the nomination by general affirmation?
In that case, I'm pleased to announce that councelor Kerry Turner is duly elected as vice chairman of the county council for the municipal year 2026 to 27.
Congratulations, councelor.
Agenda item eight.
Turner, please read your declaration of acceptance of office.
I, Kerry Turner, have been elected to the office of vice chairman of the council. Hereby declare that I take the office upon myself and will duly and faithfully fulfill the duties of according to the best of my judgment and ability. I undertake to be guided by the council's code of conduct in the performance of my functions in that office.
>> Thank you, Harry.
Agenda item eight is the election of leader of Suffukur County Council. Do I have any nominations for the leader of the council, please?
Councelor Faircloth Mutton.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I wish to nominate councelor Michael Hadwin as the new leader of Suffach County Council. Uh before I begin, uh on Tuesday, it was my fourth wedding anniversary. Uh I was unable to attend full counsel, which actually took place on uh the same day.
And I'm actually wearing the same suit that I had on that day. And I found a copy of my wedding speech in there. And I thought it'd be rather apt to wear it today because it is a new beginning. In fact, it was a new beginning for me four years ago as well.
So, I've known Michael uh for three years. We've worked closely together in several capacities, whether it be campaigning, simply discussing policy matters. We're both Suffach natives. We both educated in Suffukk and in many ways we think alike and we agree on so many issues. And contrary to the uh publication of itswitch.co.uk, we've been working in partnership some time.
We never stood against one another. So it would be an absolute delight to see councelor Hadwin uh appointed as leader uh of the county council. Uh he understands of urban Suffukk as a long-term Felix resident which I know he deeply cares about but also our coastal communities. Coastal communities in Suffukk like the rest of the UK are going through a very very difficult patch. and I know that councelor Hadwin if elected will have some impressive and welcome news needs to share with the council on that matter.
He has a listening ear to rural life.
Rural life is something which I hold dear as a rural member and I know that if elected he would put that center stage in a new administration. He believes in common sense. He is a team player and he has a full sense of direction. Councelor Hadwin has been in the engine room of Kent County Council, which succeeded in a lower than average national council tax increase at 3.99%.
Now, it's time to ramp up the engine in Suffukk as well and believe in that real change and elect Hadwin to this great office of leader of Suffuk County Council. Thank you.
>> Thank you.
Do I have a seconder, please?
Councelor Hudson.
Well, first of all, many congratulations, Mr. Chairman, and I'm very happy to see that you're the first citizen of our glorious county. Thank you. Uh, it gives me great pleasure to rise today and to to really thank and to congratulate Michael, Councelor Hadwin.
We wish him every success. It's a heavy duty because to run the council all the funds and the great sense of responsibility for all the people that work here that will work here and for all those that did work here and for anyone that's held those positions of responsibility. Our feelings are with you today, councelor Hadwin, and we think of your family and the support that you owe to them and the thought that you give to them, but more particularly to the people of Suffukk and those who back you to the hilt, at least on this side of the chamber today.
Many congratulations. I'm very happy and privileged to promote you accordingly and commend you.
Thank you, Councelor Hudson. Are there any other nominations?
In the absence of any other nominations, is the council content to agree the nomination by general affirmation?
>> Sorry, point point of order, chairman.
Uh, and congratulations. Uh under rule 8.3.13 of our council's constitution, uh there is no preclusion to debate on this item.
So is the chairman uh willing to allow members to speak on this?
>> Um I've been advised that um I can use councelor discretion to decline this uh uh your suggestion and on the also on the basis of um precedent. Uh this has never happened before.
>> Councelor Route.
>> Um if I could just reiterate the the point of order. Um Mr. Chairman, there is indeed precedent. In the 2021 council meeting of this authority, the then chairman, the late councelor Graeme Newman, invited any councelor who wished to speak to speak.
And if you're going to decline that, I'd like it recorded in the minutes that we think that you have gone against the constitution. It clearly states when the rules of debate are suspended and when they are not. In this instance, it is silent and therefore the inference is the rules of debate are live and stand.
>> Do we have any other nominations?
>> Yes, councelor.
>> Uh I also would like to speak as my colleague councelor string and councelor rout have said it is within the constitution is our right. So, are you withheld in the rights of the constitution?
Uh I've taken advice on this and uh yes we can go ahead with a debate. Councelor Stringer, you have five minutes. Uh thank you chairman and thank you for allowing members to speak on this very important appointment. Uh and again I'll read my congratulations to you in becoming chairman and to the new vice chairman. Um before I say what I'm going to say I have absolutely nothing against councelor Hadwin but I have three serious reservations about this proposal. The first reservation I had is probably the smallest one. Councelor Hadwin has never been a counselor in suffer. Uh and I think someone being elected to that offices should have at least had some of that experience. Uh the second reason uh I I I cannot vote uh for this uh appointment is uh one element of the social media history that you have in terms of your views about uh views expressed about certainly not pal I find reprehensible also uh some of your actions or rather inaction. Well over a week ago, your party was advised about some utterly vile content that was on one of your Facebook pages and it took almost a week to get a response and the response I feel was was unconvincing and when we have seen during this recent election campaign personal attacks on candidates inspired by such content and we even had our own campaigning being suspended on advice by the police because there had been a credible threat reacting from such posts. So while I I fully know what's about to happen, uh I cannot vote in that in in any good faith. Uh but I I do that in the in the spirit of respect for you as being an elected counselor. Thank you chairman for allowing me to speak.
I now invite Councelor Richard Route to speak for three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And again, I I would like to reiterate nothing um do I I hold nothing personal against council Hadwin whatsoever and I wish anyone taking on the leadership of this county council the very best of luck. But we've already seen that this um prospective new leaders every utterance is overshadowed with um stories about his past comments on social media. We've seen front pages. We've heard that he said that Enoch Pal was right. That he tweeted his wish that his PR director was a man um Milo Yiannopoulos, if I get the pronunciation correct. A man who said that behind every racist joke is a scientific fact. a man who said the one thing that Saudi Arab Arabia got right was not allowing women to drive. And then councelor Hadin, I believe you also um tweeted or or stated on social media a month after the Ssbury poisonings, Russia is not my enemy. Um I know you've said you're anti-war. I think everybody in this chamber would agree they're anti-war. But we on these benches know we're going to lose this vote, but we have a choice. We have a choice whether to vote against your leadership, whether to abstain and sit on our hands. And I think it's only correct that you're given the opportunity to address this chamber to disown your past comments.
They were eight years ago. They were eight years ago. And I think we've all made mistakes in our past. But I think it's right to give you the opportunity to stand up, say that Enoch Pal, whatever your views are on Enoch Pal, whatever your views are now on Milo um and whether or not Russia is your enemy.
I think the many Ukrainian citizens now calling Suffuk their home would like to hear that as well. Well, so I think it's it's the right opportunity for you to clear the air and allow us to make an informed decision on how we vote on your leadership going forward.
>> Councelor Fairloth Martin.
>> No, sorry. First of all, we're going through the list. So, next is councelor Mason.
>> Beg your pardon? Councelor Mason.
>> Thank you, chair. Uh firstly I'd like to congratulate uh you chair on your appointment and councelor Hadwin on his nomination for leader of uh suffer county council and also recognized for significant electoral success achieved by the form UK of the recent elections. Whatever political views members across his chamber may hold. The electorate has clearly delivered a strong message and many residents are frustrated about infrastructure, public services, condition of roads and growing sense that politics has at times become disconnected from everyday concerns.
However, chairman governing Suffuk County Council is not about slogans, rally rallies or national political branding. It's about the delivery of highly complex public services to vulnerable residents across the county.
Having observed much of the election material distributed across suffering campaign, much of which was focused heavily on national political personalities and Westminster grievances, perhaps there is perhaps a small part of me that is surprised that Nigel Farage isn't stood there himself sitting in the chamber today.
At times it was difficult to actually see anything about the candidate themselves in this reform election material.
Vital services such as adult social care, children's services are not abstract political debates. They are real world operational responsibilities with legal, financial and human consequences.
And I know having spoken to many residents during the election period that there is genu genuine nervousness about the increasing harsh and divisive tone that can sometimes emerge with recent political debate in the media, online, and in our communities.
Leadership matters. judgment matters and some of councelor hewin's past social media activity online commentary has understandably not only raised eyebrows but more importantly raised concerns across communities amongst residents who value respectful and responsible public debate campaigning is often boiled down to simple messages and slogans governing requires complex complexity compromise patience detail and And I also believe empathy and governing al often confronts you with statutory duties, procurement law, finance, financial constraints, consultation requirements and operational realities that are far less forgiving. So whilst I congratulate councelor hein on his nomination and recognize the de democratic mandate reform UK have secure sec secured I do think residents across suff will rightly expect reassurance that this council will continue to be uh conducted with seriousness. I have doubts about the suitability of this appointment.
Thank you.
Thank you counselor. I now call about call upon councelor Matthew Hicks to speak for three minutes.
>> Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and welcome to your new role.
Congratulations. Um, I think it's fair to say that becoming the leader of Suffuk County Council is one of the biggest honors certainly I've ever had and a huge privilege, but it also carries huge responsibility.
By its very nature, the role needs to set an example of the type of leader you are and the type of style and you need to reflect that across Suffukk. The leader is also an ambassador for our county both nationally and now more and more so internationally.
I just want to take the chamber back to three occasions, three happenings. The first thing was Suffukk took part really willingly in the opening up of our homes with 1,700 Ukrainian refugees coming and settling in Suffukk and many people in this chamber also opened up their homes. The second point was I had the honor of being involved with theou with the Pava region of Ukraine where we did aou around agriculture, IT and education and those visitors from Ukraine who came to Suffukk. It really was clear to me how they've been deeply impacted by the illegal invasion of Ukraine by Vladimir Putin. And I was humbled by meeting them and actually seeing them trying to go about their daily lives in such difficult circumstances was very moving.
And the third thing is I was proud that following the illegal invasion of Ukraine by Vladimir Putin uh we immediately in this chamber the first county council in the country stopped our energy contract with Gazprom a 10 million pound contract supplying our schools and all our buildings. Also in this chamber, we backed a motion where the council condemned Vladimir Putin for his immoral and reprehensible invasion of Ukraine and the council was very clear on that. It was a unanimous vote.
So why do I raise these points and I'm sorry I do not know councelor Hadwin well but I do and have looked at social media and social media is a reflection of that person. So I absolutely accept the democratic right of this chamber to elect someone but we do need to understand what is behind that person.
So I do ask my colleagues that if someone says Vladimir Putin is a uh should be viewed as an effective operator or I've still got 30 seconds here or Russia is not my enemy when this council has fought so hard to support those in Ukraine. One has to ask is councelor Hadwin actually the fit and proper person to be leader of this authority based on those comments. Now, I don't know you well, so I'd ask you to apologize, say those were errors in what you said, and retract those comments so we can have some sort of confidence that when you go out and represent this council in the public arena, you're doing so and it's something we can all support. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Councelor Hicks. I now move back to the proposer um councelor Faircloth Mutton to uh to conclude this debate.
>> You have three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I certainly won't take three minutes. I think that uh it's been very very clear in my earlier speech that councelor Hadwin will make an excellent leader of this council. It is a hyper local uh job and I think that is what we need in the current role. It is about getting the things done that our residents have been expecting us to do for many, many years.
And now is the time to finally change this and elect somebody who can do that job. And I fullheartedly support councelor Hadman's the best man to do that job. Thank you.
>> Thank you.
All right.
>> Um, I now like us to move to the vote unless uh there are any other uh speakers or any other nominations for the speakers. Debate is closed.
>> So, let's move to the vote.
seconds.
>> Okay. Um, sorry, point point of order.
Um, sorry to me. Um, councelor Route did ask um, councelor Hadwin if he wanted to disassociate himself from the comments.
Um, and I think we should actually give um, councelor Hadwin the opportunity to do that if he if he so wishes.
>> Thank you.
>> Uh, that won't be necessary. Uh, I would like to move to a vote. Um, don't press anything on your touch screen just yet.
And then if you support uh the election of councelor Hadwin to being leader, please vote yes. Uh, and if you oppose his election, please vote no. Uh, and uh, you also have an option to abstain.
Okay, if you can please make your votes.
Please ensure that your screen shows the word your vote has been passed.
Has everybody voted?
I shall now close the vote.
So with uh with 38 councilors voting in favor of the selection of uh uh Michael Hadwin as our leader. Uh as opposed to 27 who voted against and two who abstained. Um I it is uh with pleasure that I announce councelor Michael Hadwin is duly elected as the leader of Suffach County Council.
Yes. So we go back to that.
>> Agenda item nine is the executive statement. The leader of the council will have up to 20 minutes to address the council after which time I will invite a representative of each of the other political groups to respond for up to seven minutes each. I now invite the leader of the council to make the executive statement.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, may I first congratulate you and our vice chairman on taking your places today and welcome all members to the chamber. Today marks a new chapter for Suffukk County Council. But while we may come from different political traditions and hold different views, every single one of us was elected to serve the people of Suffukk. That's the duty that unites us.
I hope that where we agree, we can work constructively together. And where we disagree, we do so with civility and respect.
The people we represent expect the very best from all of us, and they deserve nothing less. Mr. Chairman, I also want to pay tribute to my predecessor, Councelor Matthew Hicks. While we do not agree on many issues politically, I know he had this he he led this council during an extraordinarily difficult and uncertain period for local government.
Leadership is never easy and it demands personal sacrifice. Suffukk owes him thanks for his service as leader and I know he'll continue to serve as residents diligently as a counselor.
Mr. Chairman, it is an enormous honor to stand here today not only as Suffukk's first reform UK leader but also as the youngest leader in the history of the council. But above all else, it is an honor to stand here as the first representative from Felix to lead the authority. I am proud to be a Felix Doughboy, fourth generation, raised to love my town, love this county, and fight for the history, identity, and traditions that make Suffukk special.
The man who taught me the value of public service and caring for for your community was my late grandfather, Phil Hadwin, known affectionately to many as Mr. Felix. He dedicated his life to preserving the history and spirit of our town. And as I stand here today, I sincerely hope I've made him proud.
As many members know, through him I developed a deep love of history, especially uh the history of Suffach itself. One figure I have always admired is Cardinal Woosey, Suffukk's own son. I attended Ipsswitch Prep School and of course Walssey himself attended Ipsswitch School before rising to become the most powerful man in England just beside the king. Not bad for an Ipswich boy.
So Mr. Chairman, let's see what a Felix Stove boy can do next.
We are fortunate in Suffach to be surrounded by history. We meet today in a council chamber named after King Edmund, England's first patron saint, whose worshiped remains lay beneath one of the most beautiful cathedrals in this country. Two of Britain's most celebrated artists, John Constable and Thomas Gainsburgh, hell from Suffukk and were inspired by the beautiful, beautiful countryside we all cherish.
Iconic writers like George Orwell, trailblazing doctors like Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, and genius World War codereers like Bill Tuttle have made strong and proud Suffukk roots. Of course, Frammingham Castle stands as one of the great symbols of our county.
Immortalizing modern culture by our own Ed Sheeran in Castle on the Hill. But long before that song, Frammlingham was where the then Queen uh future Queen Mary gathered her supporters to march on London to claim the throne. Mr. Chairman, history has a habit of repeating itself. Therefore, I suspect for too long, men and women from Suffukk will march under turquoise banners to Westminster once again.
Mr. Chairman, the people of Suffukk voted for change. They voted for services that work better, for councils that live within their means, for less bureaucracy, more accountability, and for leadership that prioritizes them. We have heard that message clearly, and this administration is determined to deliver it. In the coming weeks, my administration will set out its priorities and how we will govern differently. But for now, know this. We will be guided by a simple premise.
Community must come first. That means being transparent with residents, delivering value for taxpayers, protecting frontline services, supporting sustainable growth, reforming how this council operates, and focus relentlessly on delivery. These principles will shape every decision we make and every action we take as an administration.
But no leader succeeds alone, and I am fortunate to be surrounded by an exceptional team and who are deeply committed to serving this county. I am honored to have councelor Philip Faircloth Mutton serving as deputy leader and cabinet member for adult social care. Philip brings immense experience, patience and professionalism to one of the most demanding areas of local government. Adult social care faces growing pressures across the country and we must find ways to manage those pressures responsibly while always protecting frontline services and the dignity of those who rely upon them.
Taking on the finance, economic development and efficiency brief is councelor Vicky Armstrong. Vickiy's financial background and attention to detail will be invaluable as we ensure this council delivers value for money and operates responsibly because we must never forget that every pound we spend belongs not to us but to the people of Suffukk.
Supporting children and young people is among the greatest responsibilities any council holds. I want to make this absolutely clear today with you all.
This administration will never play politics with children.
Councelor Simon orders will lead children's services and I'm proud to have someone of his integrity, intellect and experience in local government overseeing such a vital area. Alongside him, councelor Tony Gould will oversee education and send. His experience and understanding of the challenges facing families will be invaluable as we continue improving services and ensuring no child in Suffach is left behind. Mr. Chairman, if there is one issue we heard more than any other on the doorstep, it was the condition of our roads.
People are tired of potholes becoming a normal part of everyday life. And frankly, so am I. We refuse to accept crumbling infrastructure is inevitable, and this administration is determined to get Suffach moving again safely and properly. Councelor Christopher Hudson, a veteran of this council, will lead on transport and highways. And I know he shares both my frustration and my determination to finally get a grip on this issue. and I can think of no better champion.
Councelor Tristan Gail will oversee planning devolution in the fire service.
Tristan served this country with distinction for more than two decades and public service is central to who he is. His diligence, discipline and commitment will serve suffuk extremely well.
Taking on the newly created brief of coastal affairs, communities and public health is councelor June Murray. Few people have fought harder for our coastal communities or our fishing industry than June. She has been a tireless champion for our communities and I know she will continue that fight in this important role.
And finally, Suffach's proud rural and agricultural heritage will be represented by councelor Morgan Broen as cabinet member for food waste and rural affairs. At a time when many farmers feel ignored and undervalued by national government, Suffach must stand firmly with our farming communities. As we head towards the Suffach show next week and Suffach Day next month, let us celebrate the people and industries that help make this country what it is, we must all remember, no farmers, no food.
No counselors can achieve what residents want and need without hardworking and diligent council staff. I can tell you all that Suffach County Council has exactly that. I want to thank them now for everything they do to make Suffach better every day and I look forward to working with them in the coming months to deliver even more. Mr. Chairman, while I am excited about what this administration can achieve, we must also speak honestly about the challenges ahead. One of those challenges is the current proposal for local government reorganization.
The proposal to divide Suffukk into three unitary councils risks weakening services, increasing costs, and undermining the historic identity of our county. Most importantly, we believe it poses serious risks to some of the most vital services we provide, particularly children services, adult care, and scent provision. Residents did not ask for this upheaval, nor do they want it. And it is our duty to examine every option available to fight and to protect the c the county we serve. Following discussion with other councils and with our officers, I believe there are serious concerns that must be addressed and strong grounds for a challenge, which this administration will set out in the coming days.
Mr. Chairman, there will be difficult decisions ahead. There will be moments when we are tested and moments when we undoubtedly face criticism. But I give this chamber and the people of Suffuk this commitment today. This administration will always put Suffukk first. We will work hard. We will be honest with residents. We will respect taxpayers money. We and we will give ourselves fully to the responsibility the people of Suffuk have entrusted to us because Suffuk deserves nothing less.
So, I thank you, Mr. Chairman, and every member of this chamber for your service to our county. May we all approach this responsibility with humility, decency, and compassion. Thank you, and God save the king.
Thank you, councelor. I now invite a response on behalf of the green group from councelor Andrew Stringer. Andrew, you have seven minutes.
>> Thanks, chairman. And for the second time, congratulations on your new post.
I'm sure you'll conduct it with honor and integrity and look forward to working with you. Thank you, Councelor Hadwin, for your statement. Um, we've just been through uh quite a tumultuous election uh quite eventful from our point of view uh on this side of the chamber and we're still this side of the chamber. Uh our our group grew from nine counselors up to 13 uh which was you know a huge effort and and congratulate my own team. I congratulate your team on getting 84,000 voters circa in Suffuk to vote for you. 62,000 voted for our team.
If you look at the numbers in the chamber and the numbers that voted, if that's not a clear indication that we need proportional representation, nothing does.
>> But I congratulate you on your 84,000 votes. But I'd like to remind you because we've gone through a whole process of trying to get people to vote for us. for us as individuals and different campaigners. Think about in every action you take now as an administration the 500,000 people that didn't vote for you. They're the people you need to start focusing on more perhaps than those that you've been focusing on uh in getting elected. So during this election campaign, I've was looking feverishly I need to get out more at what literature came through my door, searching for policies, searching for a nugget of something that would mean something about what would happen should the polls be correct and Reform UK take a majority in this chamber. In fact, the polls were saying the majority would be far greater than it was. So it does show you the polls can often be incorrect.
Uh, and I have to say, um, I got a lot of leaflets from a man called Nigel, and a lot of them were put through my door by a postman, which was great to see, uh, you know, uh, post office workers doing their job, but of course that cost money. So, I started working out those leaflets that came from Nigel. Well, how much must they have cost? Then I looked at how much I'm allowed to spend on my election campaign and I worked it out that every single letter that came from Nigel breached all of the spending for the whole of Suffuk.
>> Point of order, Mr. Chairman. I >> if they had have been a local election leaflet, but they were not according to central office. But I >> I retract my point of order for that clarification. Thank you.
>> Okay, that's perfectly all right. Thank you. because they will be claimed and they are claimed as a national publication. The fact they had the date of the local election on them was merely a coincidence. It's like the £5 million was merely resting in the account.
That's all it was. Nothing to see here.
So, I had to discount those leaflets because they weren't anything to do with the local campaign because they wouldn't feature in the expenses. So, I looked at what literature came through that wasn't part of that.
And all I got was a postal voter letter that was identical for a 100 mile radius of where we're sitting here now, apart from a few figures that were put into it. And I looked I desperately looked uh that's perfectly true.
>> Okay. Fine. Okay. Uh but the one the one I got from our candidate here which was incredibly similar to those around didn't have any issues that were pertinent to Sach County Council. It mentioned prosecuting fly tippers which is a district function which it is. It mentions how much we spend on our uh chief executive which was incorrect u and in fact incorrect about the post that we have there. It it's a job share between two directors.
Thank you very much. Saving Suffach County Council money and giving us an excellent service. Thank you very much.
So I I searched this document, the only relevant one I could find, for policy about what you're actually going to do.
And then it said, "You're going to fix the potholes on our local roads to keep residents safe." If only we'd have thought of that before.
Really? I mean, that's absolutely groundbreaking, isn't it? So, I actually found nothing about what you would do if you achieved this office. And I'm really disappointed to report I found out even less after your speech, councelor Adwin.
I found no item of policy about what you're actually going to do. Well, I know your former leader said you're going to need six months to train everyone. Well, perhaps that's what you're going to need. Do policy formation and then you're going to come to us in six months time with actually what you're going to do. But we haven't got that long because things as you've been trying to suggest nationally are broken and need fixing. I think we can agree that your literature, your national literature was was trying to suggest lots is broken and and we you are the people that can fix it. And that's where I get to another problem.
>> Sorry. Sorry. Okay.
>> Our colleague over may be factually incorrect.
>> I didn't say we need six months training.
The >> point of order is the statement made by councelor Stringer is erroneous, wrong, badly judged and completely misleads this council and as such it forms a point of order.
>> I did not say we need six months training. We probably need a lot more all of us because training in this establishment will be continuous will be specific. Some of it is statutory Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
>> Okay. Thank you council.
>> Sorry. Can I just clarify with the chair in the margins? That's not a point of order. What you should have asked for is a point of personal clarification.
>> Okay. So next time if I say something that's you feel is incorrect about you pop up and say point of personal clarification chairman. Not a point of order. It is not a point of order.
We have we have had we have had that training for over three years. So perhaps in the next six months we can have more training and we'll all know how to do the rules of this house. Thank you. So nationally you've been suggesting that we've got crumbling infrastructure and it's only your team that can fix it. That's where I get another issue because you were saying that the the usual flavors, the usual political establishment are the reasons we have crumbling infrastructure. Well, hang on a minute. 10% of you elected over here sat over here in previous conservative administrations. The very political establishment you are saying that broke everything. It's rather like having a plumber coming in to mend your toilet. He smashes your toilet, drills a hole in the roof, breaks your central heating, then you invite him back to repair it all and pay him twice. I mean, wh why would you suggest that more austerity is going to fix 14 years of austerity? I don't understand and I fear neither will the public. So, uh, you know, I I wish you very well and we will work with you using the experience that we've got on this side of the chamber to fix whatever is broken in Suffuk, but be really really careful that you you end up breaking things that are already working well. Thank you, chairman, and thank you for for my time. Thank you.
Thank you, Councelor Stringer. I now invite a response on behalf of the Conservative group from Councelor Richard Route. Richard, you have seven minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and first of all, my congratulations to you on being elected as chair. I will know you will do a a fair job as you have already done so today. And and congratulations also to to councelor Hadwin. um despite the beginning of this meeting, his success going forward is Suffach success and his failure suffuk failure. So I wish him the very best. I do wish that he'd taken the opportunity to to perhaps distance himself from those remarks so that it didn't overshadow his executive statement so much. But um I do wish him the best going forward. It's also very good to see that so many members in the new administration got the memo that ties do come in colors other than turquoise. Um it's good to see. It's good to see turquoise actually is made from two parts blue. Um you've got lots of parts blue already. Um and one part green.
Andrew, you've got more to spare than we have. Would you mind um lending them some green? Um but it's clear um in the chamber today that reform took many of our seats. They took some of our formula councilors. Um and looking at councelor Hudson, they also took our insatiable prediliction for rigidside.
um they can keep the counselors, they can keep the leader culling um tendencies, but we'll be taking the seats back.
It's also interesting to see that that Matt Goodwin's recent commentary is is playing out as well that the party is divided into Tory reformers and reform reformers. And I think here in Suffukk that the Tory reformers are are ruling the roost and at least that gives um some sense of of continuity. But the the the message on the doorstep um Mr. chairman was that residents wanted change, that they were frustrated, that they are disenfranchised by this government that makes U-turn after U-turn. Um, but looking as councilor Stringer has said at the reform manifesto, I saw no commitments for Suffukk, just national rhetoric. Um, I imagine some of the new councilors were quite surprised that there wasn't a training session for stopping the boats.
Um, but perhaps you could introduce one, Mr. Chairman, for those of us now in opposition opposition, there is comfort in the fact that reform are being found out quickly where they do lead and losing around 10% of their counselors in the in the first year. And why are they being found out? It's because the difference between what they say on the doorstep and what they say in leaflets and the truth is being quickly exposed.
Look at council Hadwin's former home in Kent. They issued a press release in February claiming a hundred million pounds in savings. Um and as ever the truth was was very far from this and I think even Kent now have tried to retreat from that statement and started referring to reprofiling future spend rather than rather than savings.
Uh they're very different things they're very different things council happen because the the clever trick that reform are playing is that they try to cancel long-term capital spending and then portray it as a saving. It's like saying, "I'm going to buy a Ferrari."
Oh, no, I'm not. I've saved £400,000.
And this is the trick they play. This is the trick they play. They tried to um I think repay, and you'll know this better than me, councelor Hwin, £50 million worth of debt 41 years early. Um and claimed that that had saved around £670,000 a year in debt interest. What they didn't mention was that if that money was invested, it would have made around around um 2 million per year in interest on the money they used to pay it back. So in fact, it represented a net loss of 1.3 million pounds a year.
Um they scrapped the move from one HQ to another but failed to realize that would cost them more in maintenance costs on the old building. So time after time, Mr. chairman reform are cancelling theoretical spending but imposing dayto-day costs on their administrations and I fear the same thing will be the case here in Suffach. I've already heard I think council Hadwin your concerns around the um energy savings spend at this council or the decarbonization spend um as it was once termed but written into that program is the fact that it must make in-year savings. So it will only be spent if the savings from it exceed the cost of borrowing. cancel that and in effect you are adding to the revenue spend.
But there's other worrying trends emerging from reform councils. Mr. Chairman, it's the cancellation of scrutiny committees. Um the banning of the press and I think we've seen that in Ipsswitch as well where members were told they could not speak to the local press at the count. I just hope Mr. chairman and councelor Haban under under your leadership that we will still see here in Suffukk proper scrutiny of the administration and I was pleased to see actually that Julia councelor Huitt will be taking on the chairmanship of scrutiny. So but I I do hope those meetings will continue properly here and not be canceled as they have under other reform administrations and that you will be allowing all of your members to speak in debates like those coming up this afternoon on the two motions and speak to the press. It's incredibly important that they have access. people like Jao who's behind me the local democracy reporter I think his counterpart in Nottingham Sharia was banned for some time I really hope we don't see that sort of practice here so Mr. Mr. Chairman, there is a pattern of behavior from other reform administrations. Um, I I go into this one wishing councelor Hadwin all the best, but I am skeptical based on what I have seen elsewhere.
There were many words in his executive statement um far more than perhaps were in any leaflet we saw coming through our doors um during the election campaign, but still very little mention of his plans for Suffukk. I do hope we hear more of those going forward, but we on these benches will continue to hold him to account on the promises that he makes. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Councelor Route. I now invite a response on behalf of the Labor Group from Councelor Martin Cook.
Martin, you have seven minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. chairman and congratulations on your election.
Congratulations also to councelor Hadwin as his election um to leader of the council. Um I did have a theory that reform candidates didn't knock on many doors in this election campaign. Uh and now I know that they didn't because the issues that people were raising on the doorstep are not the issues that we've heard about today. First and foremost, an Ipsswitch northern bypass.
We've heard nothing about that. We'll talk about it later, but very interesting to note that that isn't a priority, it seems, for this new administration. Like councelor Stringer, I received a number of leaflets through my door, not just from the postman, but um councelor Hill was a frequent visitor to my door as well with his leaflets.
Um, one of them, I think it was referred to earlier, talked about um, the council's debt of 756 million um, and uh, money spent on debt interest. I haven't heard any proposals about what was going to be done about that. So, what what was the purpose of that leaflet in raising that issue if not to do something about it? We've heard nothing on that whatsoever.
Councelor Hadwin and his new reform administration on the other hand seem hellbent on the moment they've taken office spending an estimated £100,000 or more on challenging um the decisions on local government review which is not something that I think is supported by the general public. I think that um you know the general public want to see decision making taken closer to communities not to be kept far away from them and they do not support I believe a countywide authority.
So we we'll also be watching to see what happens under the name of this new reform administration and we'll be holding them to account also on their decisions. Thank you.
Thank you, Councelor Cook. I now invite a response on behalf of the Liberal Democrat group from Councelor Inger Lockington.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and congratulation and congratulations to the leader. I hope you will serve us all well. Uh it's been interesting to listen to the debate and it's interesting to hear what reform has had to tell us about because like somebody else has mentioned here residents certainly received a lot of information from Farage.
It was letters that came delivered by the postman. just mentioned the ones we received was mainly addressed to my husband. Occasionally there was a link to a Mrs. Lockington on them, but otherwise, you know, they were they were for for the men in the house.
Um, you know, I did not see anything specific about Suffukk and I did not mention much about any local candidates.
One of our canvases called on a resident down the road and asked whether she was going to vote for me this time and he said no I know Inga does a lot of work but I'm going to vote for reform. The canvas carefully asked her if she knew where her candidate lived. She was a little flustered and then she said Clton. I think that's the impression people had. They said we voting for Faradage. He lives in Clapton. It's not the local person.
I received an email from another president a couple of days after the election who asked me now reform will be running the council. How will their priorities affect social care and scen and of course our votes?
I had to respond, I don't know because I haven't seen anything about that in any information coming to to me. All I've seen is vote for change, but whatever change is change. I don't know.
Having spoken with many of our residents, I can let you know that precisely what they wanted, what we heard in the first speech here today, that was things for the common good.
What they wanted was to live in peace with their neighbors. They wanted to live in a good street. They want their street to be kept clean. And you know, everyone just want to get on with everybody else. We don't want to live in a world where we have to sort of dislike other people.
I'm one of these, as you could probably hear when I talk, one of these foreigners who arrived on a boat. Okay.
It was a fair boat landing at Harris many, many years ago. I was born in Denmark simply because my mother gave birth to me in Denmark. None of us choose the country we born in. So, please remember that I've now lived in Suffach for over 30 years and it's a lovely place. We've heard something about war suffer and I understand all suffer because I grew up on a small farm in the north of Denmark.
I understand rural life but now I live in Ipsswitz and we must not forget our people who live in our towns and cities.
There's Ipsswitz, there's low stuff, there b there are many places which are built up areas and they have their own issues which we need to deal with.
Uh the last in the last budget we supported the budget proposed by the conservatives because we knew that every money every bit of penny we could get in was already asked for.
When you start to look at savings as you said you want to do please don't forget that there are many of these savings you may be looking at that some of our residents really depends on.
Please don't forget our family cares.
If our family cares are not supported, they might give up caring and then you will end up with a far higher burden and a far higher cost. The tati sector in suffuk is struggling because there's not the money about that there used to be.
We need to early help our children, our young people because wherever children come from, we need to be sure that they get the best start in life. So we need to support, we need to support our schools because schools are not only about learning the sort of basics. But nowadays our schools are places where you bring children up to be good citizens, you know. So we must remember our teachers and our school, all the staff.
We also know that our residents, they want good roads. And of course the cyclist, they want good roads too because there's nothing worse than when a cyclist hit a pothole. They might be come worse off than even if I broke my tire in my car. I don't know. So and of course there are many many issues. Can I say I'm sad to hear that you want to stop unitary authorities because having been on both Ipsar council and the county council now for over 127 years this 125 I can say that there are so many things that'll be far better off with unitary authorities but we want yes because you will not have one local authorities that like blame another for you So we have the nonsense that you know the when grass is growing when it's green it's the county council responsibility if it becomes then it's the bars and the districts and so on. There are so many issues and it will also be far better for social services because when it when we come to planning you know we can then really plan between social services what need there is for care homes and so on. you know, we can far better plan together. So, I really hope we get unitized. I know I was a supporter of a council in Southern in South London where my husband was a council for four years and they are still a lovely unitary still run by Liberal Democrats. So, I I know it can work.
So can I just say the next few months here we need to think about our staff because of course I'm well aware that there are staff we have some wonderful staff who are so committed to serving the public.
So wherever they are, we must support them too because their life is not always the easiest life to be because of course I want roads fixed quickly and I want my potholes filled in quickly and I may not always be patient enough but we must remember our staff and while we go towards unitary remember our staff and support them. I hope we get unitary. I will certainly be very sad if we don't.
If we miss that then that will be a real shame for the long term.
>> Thank you councelor Lockington.
That concludes agenda item nine. We now move on to agenda item 10, the appointment of committees and chairman.
Agenda item 10 is a report by the joint chief executives. I now call upon councelor Tony Love to move the recommendations. Tony, you have five minutes.
>> I'd just like to reflect just for a second, but I hope everybody listened to the wide words, the wise words of the very reverend Joe Hawks.
So uh agenda item 10 appointments of committees and chairman.
This report details the number of seats on that are available on the council's committees which have been calculated following the rules of political proportionality.
Appendices one, two, and three to the report have been tabled at today's meeting, and copies have been uploaded to the council's website.
Appendix one sets out the overall number of seats allocated by group and appendix two sets out the number of seats allocated to each group by committee.
Appendix three shows the names allocated to committees by each political group and the recommendations for chairman of each committee.
The council is asked to agree the number of seats on committees as indicated in appendices one and two and the appointment of chairman to those committees as indicated in appendix 3.
>> Thank you councelor. Um councelor love do you have a second now?
>> I do.
Councelor Paul Baines.
I second that.
>> Thank you, Councelor. You You have three minutes to speak if you want to add to it or otherwise.
>> Got nothing further to add.
>> Okay. Thank Thank you.
Councelor Andrew Stringer, as the spokesperson for the opposition, you may speak for up to five minutes at any time during the debate.
Does any other counselor wish to speak in the debate?
If you do, please raise your hand.
Okay.
>> Right. Councelor Love, as proposer of the motion, do you have anything further to add?
>> Thank you, councelor. Is it the wish of the council to agree the recommendation by general affirmation?
>> Thank you, councilors.
We'll now move on to agenda item 11.
Agenda item 11 is a report by the joint chief executives. I now count call on councelor Tony Love to move the recommendations.
You have five minutes. Thank you, sir.
Program of meetings, June 26 to May 28th.
This report sets out the proposed program of meetings for Suffuk County Council from June 2026 through to May 2028.
Every effort has been made to try and afford clashes, particularly with a party conference season, major meetings of the LGA and the CCN.
I'm not very good at MAC acronyms, so I looked that one up and that is the county councilor's network. I've been educated this afternoon. It's their conference. Suffuk Day also has been taken into consideration and school holidays where these dates are known.
There are some changes to the previously published dates in 2026 and 2027 and these are detailed in paragraphs 11, 12 and 13 of your report.
In addition, paragraph 10 of the paper states that cabinet meetings continue to be held on Tuesdays.
And whilst this will need to continue for the immediate future, we would be looking to move cabinet meetings to Thursdays going forward to avoid any clashes on dates on which full council is taking place.
Democratic services will notify all counselors and update the website with any changes to cabinet dates ensuring appropriate notice has been given.
I would like to highlight that the first meetings of the education and children's services scrutiny committee on the 18th of June scrutiny committee on the 30th of June and health scrutiny committee on the 1st of July will take the form for informal workshop sessions.
This will provide an opportunity for the new committee members to meet together and with officers to look at priorities and challenges and to start to determine their formal forward work programs for the coming years.
Finally, councilors will receive outlook calendar appointments from the democratic services team in due course.
Now the memberships have been confirmed.
All councilors will receive appointments for cabinet council and committee reserve dates.
Other meetings will be sent to the members of the committee only. Council is invited to agree the calendar of meetings whilst noting the additional points raised. Thank you.
>> Thank you councelor. Um do you have a second?
>> I do sir. Um, Councelor Baines, Paul Baines, you you may speak now for three minutes or reserve the right speak.
>> Mr. Chairman, um, I'm happy to second that and I've got nothing further to add.
>> Thank you, Councelor.
Uh, Councelor Andrew Stringer, as the spokesman for the opposition, you may speak for up to five minutes at any time during the debate.
Does any other counselor wish to speak on this?
Okay.
Okay.
Councelor Love, as proposer of the motion, do you have anything further to add?
Is it the wish of the council to agree by the recommendation by general affirmation?
>> Thank you councilors.
Agenda item 12 is a report by the joint chief executives. I now call on councelor Tony Love to move the recommendations.
Thank you.
>> This is the appointments to outside bodies.
Agenda item 12.
This report sets out the arrangements for the county council to appoint councelor representatives to outside bodies and partnerships.
Appendix one to the report has been tabled and provides a full list of the outside bodies to which the council makes appointments along with the category of the body A, B or C as defined in paragraph 10 of the report.
Council is asked to confirm the arrangements for the appointment of counselors to the bodies listed in appendix one in accordance with the procedures set out in paragraphs nine and 10 of the report.
Democratic services will be in touch in the near future contacting relevant counselors asking you to come forward if you are interested in the positions listed.
Thank you, councelor. Um, councelor Paul Baines, uh, would you like to speak now or reserve the right to speak later?
>> Thank you again, Mr. Chairman. Again, I'm happy to second and nothing further to add.
>> Thank you, councelor.
Councelor Andrew Stringer, as the spokesperson for the opposition, you may speak for up to five minutes at any time during the debate.
Does any other counselor wish to speak in the debate?
Councelor Wellum, you have three minutes. I'll take about 30 seconds.
>> All right.
>> Um, chair, I'm just wondering why there are appointments to some of the Citizens Advice Bureau, but not to Midsuffford.
>> Okay. your your question is noted and I'll ask uh councelor love to get back to you.
Does any other counselor wish to speak?
Councelor Love, as proposer of the motion, do you have anything further to add?
>> No, I don't.
>> Thank you, councelor. Is it the wish of the council to agree the recommendation by general affirmation?
>> Okay, that's agreed. Thank you, councelor.
Uh before we go to the motions, um would you like to take a break or shall we uh continue on? Take a break. I think we need a break. 10 minutes. 10 minutes, please.
Councilors, please take your seats.
Agenda item 13, motion number one.
I now call on councelor Andrew Stringer to propose the motion. Andrew, you have five minutes.
>> Thank you, chairman. Councilors, um we moved this motion today uh to try and lay down a marker really about how we value some of the really good services that this council does give to our residents and and even to those that maybe might be coming our residents. Um, we spoke earlier and there's a little bit of prickiness about me making a claim about a certain leaflet being the same for 100 mile radius. So, I'm just going to quote from a leaflet from where's this leaflet from? This one is from Peterbr Council. The finances of Labor run Peterbrra Council are a mess.
The CEO is paid du more than the prime minister and so much is spent on debt interest over a single week. £167,000 is spent on translation services for those that refuse to integrate. We now go over to Norfolk. Uh the finances of Tory run Norfolk Council are a mess. The CEO is paid D a year uh more than the prime minister. Uh X is spent on debt interest every single week and uh £400,000 is spent on translation services for those that refuse to integrate. We now get closer to home to Suffukk. So quite by coincidence, the postal voter letter from this candidate says the finances of Tory run Suffach County Council RMS the CEO is paid that's actually incorrect. We have a joint CEO but that's another point. um per year 20,000 more than prime minister, £537,000 spent on debt interest payments every single week and £283,000 spent on translation services for those that quote refuse to integrate.
Now the first part of that is incorrect.
The figure is not 283,000. It's £240,000.
But we need to be clear about that phrase for those that refuse to integrate. Let's get real about who these people are. So we've looked at the budget. Good thing to do, best place to start before you write a letter that goes to three counties.
So it's spent on the homes for Ukraine program. So those people being offered homes here in Suffukk fleeing a war, an illegal war, are refusing to integrate.
According to that leaflet, the other part of the spend for this is on children seeking sanctuary. So those children seeking sanctuary here in Suffukk from wherever part of the world or Suffuk or England as a whole or Britain as a whole are refusing to integrate because they're using translation services. And it gets better. The other part of the spend is on sign language.
for those that are hard of hearing and deaf according to this leaflet that are refusing to integrate. So you are claiming that the deaf are refusing to hear. I think those that voted in response to this leaflet for three counties, over three counties, deserve this administration to be put on record at the earliest possible opportunity to say we got that a little bit wrong and we value the service that we give to those that are coming here from the Homes for Ukraine program. that we value those children that are here seeking sanctuary and we value those people who cannot hear and need our sign languaging services because I believe and I think this council believes that education and communication is a really really good thing and if you believe that educating people is a very good thing you need to value that translation services you need to value it even more because the vast majority of that money isn't the council taxpayers money of Suffukk. It's general taxation money that gets given to us by central government. So even more misleading was this leaflet. It was misleading in five different areas. So the motion's simple. It just says that this council values the translation service that Suffach County Council gives and we can now all be held to account for voting on it. And I look for a second. Thank you, chairman.
Thank you, Councelor Stringer. Uh, Councelor Robert Lindsay, uh, would you like to speak now or reserve your right to speak later?
>> I'll reserve my right to speak, please, Chair.
>> Thank you. Um, Councelor Simon Alders, as the spokesperson for the administration, you may speak for up to five minutes at any time during the debate.
I will now open the debate. If you wish to speak, please signal clearly that you wish to do so and wait for confirmation that your signal has been received by the monitoring officer because speak now.
>> You want to speak now?
>> Right. Go ahead.
>> Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Yes. Well, our party, our winning party is not going to engage in this kind of political stunt. We're focused on delivering efficient, high-quality services for the residents of Suffukk and not on wasting time on this sort of posturing. It's such a shame that the words of the very reverend halls have been so quickly forgotten by members opposite, but possibly not surprising.
So, I am therefore voting this motion down, voting no for this motion, and I urge my colleagues and anyone else who focused on delivering the best for the people of Suffukk to do the same.
>> Thank you, Mr. Ch.
>> Thank you, councelor.
>> Councelor Hopkinsburgger first, please.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. May I congratulate you on your um office? Um I'm sure you'll do a very good job.
Thank you very much. As you have done so far. Wow. Um, it's quite hard to follow that that speech, but it is important that we speak honestly and responsibly about what these translation services are, who they support, and why they matter.
Unfortunately, the recent commentary from Reform UK, as as read out, has suggested Suffach County Council spends hundreds of thousands of pounds on translation services for people who refuse to integrate. That may make for eye-catching slogans, but it bears little resemblance to the reality. The overwhelming majority of these costs sits for children and young people's services, particularly statutory send services.
Why? Because families are being supported through the EHCP assessments, safeguarding processes, and annual reviews for children with additional needs. These are not optional documents.
They are legal and professional papers that determine what support a vulnerable child receives. Parents cannot properly participate in decisions affecting their child or indeed the child themselves if they cannot fully understand the documentation placed in front of them.
It's not about refusing to integrate.
It's about ensuring a mother understands her autistic child's ECHP. It's about helping a father engage in safeguarding discussions. is about supporting a child with a hearing impairment to understand what support is in place for them. Many of these young people require support into adulthood and a positive transition planning is essential.
I will not apologize and translation costs have risen when Suffach County Council is processing more EHCPs and more vulnerable children are finally receiving the assessments and the support they've waited too long for.
Other translation spending supports asylum seeking children, adult social care, public health and safeguarding work, not luxury services, but frontline public services. We should also be careful about the language you use to suggest everyone requiring translation refuses to integrate unfairly stereotypes vulnerable residents, many of whom are working hard, contributing to their communities, and simply trying to access essential services.
Mr. Chairman, I do feel somewhat saddened that we need to have this debate. Yes, we can debate spending priorities. That is legitimate. But we should do so based on facts, not rhetoric that risks dividing communities or undermining support for vulnerable residents. Translation services are not about encouraging separation. They're about fairness, safeguarding, dignity, and ensuring people can access the support they need. Thank you.
Thank you, Councelor Hopkinsburgger. Uh, I now call upon councelor Adrien Whittle to speak. You have three minutes.
>> Thank you, Chair. Um, we all recognize that translation services have a role in statutory work. When a safeguarding case depends on clear communication, the council must meet its legal duties. This is not in dispute. But this motion from councelor Stringer tries to turn a routine operational cost into a moral virtue. It asks us to value the spend itself as if rising translation bills are something to celebrate. They are not. They are a cost to the taxpayer and a rapidly growing one. According to Suffach County Council's own Fry disclosures, translation and interpretation spending has risen from around30,000 a year in 201617 to 145,000 last year. That is a fourfold increase totaling over £800,000 since 2016.
Where does it go? Not to an in-house team, not to local capacity, but overwhelmingly to external commercial providers for face-to-face interpreters, telephone interpreting, written translations, and specialist casework.
Demand is rising across children's services and adult social care with more languages, more complexity and higher commercial rates. These are operational pressures, not political statements, and they certainly aren't something to applaud without scrutiny.
So the real question is this is Suffach County Council getting value for money because taxpayers expect us to ask that.
They expect us to challenge rising overheads. They expect us to prioritize frontline services, not quietly absorb a 400% increase in transition translation costs. Reform UK councilors support translation where it is legally required to do so. But we will not sign up to a motion that treats spend rising as a virtue in itself. Accountability matters. value for money matters and encouraging English language acquisition rather than permanent dependency on translation matters too. For those reasons, chair, we cannot support this motion as drafted.
Thank you, councelor. Uh, I now call upon councelor Richard Route to speak.
You have 30 Sorry, you have >> really give me 30 minutes, Mr. Chairman.
I'll get myself into all sorts of trouble. Um, >> three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I was struck recently by um a headline alongside Councelor Hadwin's photo saying, "I don't want to see Suffuk divided." And I'm desperately trying to take him at his word on that. I think the problem is um that some people do want to see Suffuk divided, not necessarily through lines on a map, but through lines through our society, through our culture by creating division where none previously existed, to pray on it and to seek political capital through it. I was proud today when I arrived at Endeavor House to see the Ukrainian flag flying alongside the Suffukk flag and below the Union flag on our building. I was proud to see that and I hope that it will continue to fly. Not like in Essex where a day or so later it was taken down. But this this motion today from councelor Stronger is very simple. It says that we value our translation services. That is a question and I think we value all of our services. We might think that we spend too much on them. We might think we spend too little on them. But to say that we do not value a service, what message are you sending at this first meeting to our staff? If you vote down this motion, you are saying you do not value a service within this council.
>> Now, quite interestingly on social media this week, did you see that Lincolnshire County Council has come under fire for something from um from Restore and from RERT low? Do you know what it is?
Anyone?
>> They're spending on translation services. Um and and the defense that came up on social media was, well, it's all statutory. We have to do it anyway, etc., etc. Now, I forget the new council's name. I'm really sorry. Councelor, who spoke before me, Whittle. Councelor Whitt. Um, if this was a motion about um whether or not this represented value for money, then put that on on our leaflet. Put that put out there that Suffach County Council spends £2,000 on translation services. Is that value for money? You didn't put that. You said on people who refuse to integrate. on people who refuse to integrate. Our deaf people councelor Whittle refusing to integrate our blind people refusing to integrate. A people displaced here by Vladimir Putin's illegal invasion of Ukraine refusing to integrate.
90% of this spend goes on children, on vulnerable children. Some of it goes on Braille. Some of it goes on sign language. I'm sorry. If you say you do not value that service, it sends completely the wrong message to Suffuk, our staff and our residents.
>> Thank you, councelor. I now call upon councelor Michael Hadwin to speak for three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, firstly, for for those of us who are new to this chamber, how condescending and patronizing some of you are, this is meant to be a place where we talk about the benefits and the work we do for the people of Suffukk, not try to hold a high horse when actually my opening speech was about how we could work together. I hope you might learn something from that. With this motion is clearly playing political games.
>> We are not here to play that. At no point have we said that we're going to make a cut to translation services. I've done many interviews and that's the poor thing about this. You say, "Oh, we have no clue what he stands for." You know, I have done nothing but engage with the media and explain very clearly what we want to do. Just read it. So, the fact is here that us voting against this is not saying we do not value translation services. We're not that cheap. What we're saying is we do not value you trying to take council time for a poor political stunt motion like this. And let me make something very very very clear. I will not take lessons on elector election literature from the likes of you when look at the number of you and look at the number of us. That's the clear thing. Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Councelor Rocks, you have three minutes.
>> Thank you, Chair, and congratulations on your own election. Um, what a speech to follow. Um, I have the fortunate task of representing the best division in in the whole of Suffuk. I'm sorry I'm a bit biased, but it represents the Burious Nemesis Town Center and some of the most historic parts of our county. A bit of an ironic twist of fate considering my own age. Um, and believe it or not, like many counselors, at least on this side, maybe not so much over there, I've spent the last two months of my life talking to thousands of my residents. And they have come from all different backgrounds and different walks of life. Some like myself being born and raised in Berry, some in Suffukk, more from the UK, but also a lot of people who were not born here.
No matter what, all of these people said three things to me. They cared about Berry. They cared about their community.
They wanted to see it improve. And that is why it is so vital that we value services such as translation services who are trying to make migrants lives easier. In in West Suffuk, noting only one example of how my residents benefit from migration, 20% of workers approximately at the West SuffK hospital come from overseas. Additionally, migration has informed our local culture and identity with the p with the abbey being a key pilgrimage point for so many. Acceptance is woven into Barry's heart. And what worried me was the volatility of the politics we saw through uh throughout May and how that made members of my community from all different backgrounds feel. I stood for election to help my residents, not to harm them. And that is why it is so important that we value the services trying to make our residents lives easier, especially when they are coming into our communities during one of the most confusing periods of their lives.
These are people who want to help, want to be included and want to be involved and to use them as a political football is not right. That is why it is so important that we celebrate those elections. That is why it is so important that we celebrate those services and you can chant as much as you'd like but they are your residents as well and as you said we are here to represent Suffukk which includes those benefit benefiting currently from translation services. How do they feel looking at the way the administration has conducted itself today? Thank you.
Thank you, councelor. I now call upon councelor Mace to speak for three minutes.
>> Uh, thank you, chair. Uh, I've changed my speech quite a lot from what I was intending to say. Uh I had been concerned by the way that this issue had been communicated to residents and there may be many things I disagree with councelor Stringer on but I think the refusal to integrate was an alarm as to the sentiment about why to choose those particular words uh attached to a service that is so valued.
I think councelor Whittle is trying to rewrite that that election material uh during during this meeting. Uh I totally agree with councelor route that uh the discussion very much from pulling back to councelor stream's point of view was on the concerns raised by that one particular sentence.
Uh so I was concerned about how that had been communicated where complex issues are sometimes reduced down to simplistic talking points but risk unnecessary division or hostility between communities. And if we're not careful we can sometimes end up with bigotry wrapped up as common sense when in reality the issue is far more nuanced and far more human than that.
It's not a stunt councelor or to call out misleading the electorate which I think is the hub of what councelor struggle was talking about >> I am threatened >> carry on carry on >> you seem like you've got a delicate underbelly where you don't seem to be able to receive some criticism a genuine concern raised by counselors from across different parties. You seem to be feeling quite vulnerable.
I'm now concerned that this new administration has shown how comfortable it it feels when held to account. The responses are very interesting and it'll be interesting to see how often you respond similar to that sense of criticism which will be coming your way.
Uh, councelor Leech, you have three minutes.
>> Thank you very much, Chair.
invas and looking around the room I see we need some interpretation and clearly I am able to integrate.
I wonder if this is what it feels like to be a vulnerable child trying to communicate or a parent who's trying to advocate for their child's well-being.
Our translation services offer an intrinsic and practical value to the services offered by Suffach County Council. In our vibrant and diverse county, these services ensure that language is not a barrier, but rather a bridge that enables inclusion and access and the delivery of an equitable public service. Translation services enable Suffach County Council to fulfill their legal and ethical obligations so that all residents can understand their rights and responsibilities.
It helps to avert misunderstandings, reducing risk of costly errors, repeated inquiries and service delays. And believe me, this goes both ways. This protects Suffach County Council as well as looking after vulnerable residents.
It also offers an access to information which encourages residents to participate in consultations. Otherwise, how do I know what some of my residents feel and want for the community? the very people that voted me into support them and represent them. It helps us to understand council discussions and to strengthen democratic engagement which is vital.
In summary, translation services are not just a nice to have. They are a core public service that upholds accessibility, builds trust and enhances efficiency.
By investing in highquality translation services, Suffach County Council ensures that every resident can participate fully in public life. And these are the residents that I'm standing here to support. It allows residents to receive accurate information and to access the help they need with dignity and with clarity. Don't take that away from our people. I will be supporting the motion to express how much this these services are valued and thank you very much for proposing it.
Thank you, councelor. Councelor Inger Lockington, you have three minutes.
Thank >> Thank you, chairman. And I will speak in English. I could speak in Danish, but no, I you know, it is just so important that we have the services for the you know, when they are needed. I was lucky when I came to the UK, I had learned some English in back in Denmark. So, I got on with it but some people haven't that. And when you think about it because I looked up to and what we are spending on which is absolutely being said here is the unaccomp unaccompanied side of children and uh it's children young people it's adult social care. No, these are not people who are refusing to integrate. And if you had not put that on that leaflet going around, we would never have had that debate here today.
So, think about what you put on a leaflet because that's the reason why we have the debate today. It would never have been here because it's never been here in the 25 years I've been a county counselor. It's never been debate. It's just been there that service. And we have many people the day we had election I stood outside the polling station and suddenly I thought lots of people coming to vote. No they were not. I stood outside the church and the church provide English classes and it was the sofa refugees that was coming to learn to speak English and it was lovely to see. And when I meet somebody who find speaking English a bit more difficult than I do, I always say to them, please learn because for your own sake because if you learn to speak English then you know you can get your own information because the problem is with translation we can never translate everything in the world. So somebody else decide your information. So it's also about speaking to people you know and encourage them to go and learn to speak English but the services we're talking about today is for people who really need it. So let's not have I wish we had not had that that debate here today but it comes from your side. So think about what you put on leaflet in future.
Thank you, councelor. Councelor Richardson, you have three minutes.
>> Thank you very much, uh, Mr. Chairman.
Uh, as this is the first time I've spoken properly, uh, in this chamber as a county council, I would like, with your indulgence to briefly pay tribute to my predecessor, uh, Joanna Spicer was a county counselor for 37 years and is the very embodiment of a dedicated, hardworking public servant.
Joanna is a formidable woman and though she can be tough, Joanna also has a heart of gold. Her warmth and kindness are perhaps best demonstrated by her and her husband Christopher's decision in 2022 to welcome Ukrainian refugees into their own home. This was a mother along with her young daughter. Her husband, a soldier, had been captured by the Russians as a prisoner of war shortly after the illegal invasion of Ukraine.
And that brings me to the substance of this motion because I am hugely proud of the fact that in the years since more than 1,700 Ukrainian refugees have been accommodated within Suffukk supported by this council.
And let's not forget these individuals have taken refuge here at our invitation because of that illegal invasion of Ukraine. A regime that has actively been kidnapping Ukrainian children. That is the same regime that the leader of the council, the new leader thinks isn't our enemy. And I know it was eight years ago, but we gave him two opportunities in this chamber to distance himself from those remarks and he declined to do so.
>> Now, unsurprisingly, most of those people who have come here don't speak fluent in English because they've never needed to. But so many have integrated into our society and have benefited from that translation service in doing so, particularly in education. Now, not all of the council's translation services, of course, are directed towards Ukrainian refugees, but that's not what the substance of this motion is about.
It is about the value of the service that the council provides. Now, there are plenty of valid arguments about scrutinizing how public money is spent, and as conservatives, we will never shy away from that. But 0.031, that is the percentage of the county council's budget that we spend on translation services. Even if we spend a fraction of that supporting people fleeing war in Europe, then I would consider that money well spent. That is the value of this service and long may it continue.
>> Um, Councelor Hudson, you have three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. None of us on this side is questioning at all the requirements of British sign language, the statutory duties that we have, disability, these are given. These are almost universal rights that we're not questioning. But let's look carefully.
Britain functions best when English is the common civic language.
>> That should be our gold standard.
>> That should be our aim. not a multilingual nonsense where we're trying to integrate people. It's very important that Britain functions best and that we teach people through Tessle, through TEFL, through the many, many means that are available. Integration is our goal.
Are we going to have no spending limits?
Is it open to any audit at all?
Were the rate payers ever asked how much they want to spend?
What are the metrics? Should we spend a million, 10 million?
It's an unknowable and increasing cost on the public purse.
And we have priorities to find and we need to control the public purse because there is no dough left.
We'd all like to spend money on things, but we have to prioritize what we're going to spend on. Yes, put people into TEFL. Yes, get people to integrate so that they become British citizens and proud to be part of our country. Because I fear, as somebody from the Labor bench has said, that we could be sleepwalking, did not the prime minister say this, we could be sleepwalking into parallel lives. and we have parallel bureaucracies and then we need more and more of this expense. Not a good aim, Mr. Chairman.
Routine bureaucracy can give a reason for permanent multilingualism and then there's no incentive to change it. So, we need some common sense. The performance metrics, the integration targets, where are they? They're very important but they're not there. The expense is there. More TEFL more Tessle the other means of doing that they would be vital.
Really what I'm saying here is core services are our priority and we haven't got enough money for them.
Now, this is a wish list and I don't doubt it's a good one, but we our core services are critical. I leave you with this. Britain functions best when English is the common civic language.
Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor. I now call about upon councelor Bobby Bennett to speak for three minutes.
Um, thank you. Thank you, um, chair, and congratulations on your appointment.
It's lovely to see you back in this chamber.
This motion is important because it's one of the few things that you've actually told us that you stand for on the myriad of leaflets that that came through the door and that's why I'm I'm standing to speak and it's why I'm I'm going to support your your motion, councelor Stringer. And uh, congratulation on your appointment as as lead member, councelor Alders. In my view, it's the most important role in the council. It comes with a lot of statutory duties. There's a document. It goes on for pages and you will hear some of the most difficult things you've ever heard, but you will also hear some of the most heartwarming things you've ever heard.
And counselors that know me will know that I never miss an opportunity to remind us all about our duty as corporate parents. Every single one of us in this chamber is a corporate parent for our children in care. And that includes every single one of our our children seeking sanitary or are asylum seeking children and our role as that our duty our statutory duty is to constantly ask ourselves would this be good enough for my child.
So if you vote down this motion what you're really doing is telling us that you do not understand your statutory duties. You're telling us you don't know what your job is. Thank you.
>> Thank you. councelor. Um we're uh we've got five more speakers to speak before I call upon uh councelor Simon Alders to uh uh give a closing statement. Uh the next is councelor Wellum. You have three minutes.
>> Thank you chair. Sorry I forgot to congrat congratulate you on your position as chair when I spoke quickly earlier. So I do now. um you've got a difficult job. It's um it's very difficult to chair a debate when virtually all of the discussion is coming from one side. We haven't heard much from those who are uh opposite. Um they appear to have no desire to take part, which is a pity really. We want to hear from them. Um I received four letters from Nigel and one of them actually had my wife's name on as well.
Um and and the one letter that I had from Charles Tilbury who who was the candidate, he included the reference to the translation service. I won't go through the details of that. We our leader has already uh said said that.
But I go back to what councelor Wickham said about the um the increase in the cost of the translation services. Well, in in councelor Plo Mutton, you've got the person who can best explain to you all about that because he was a member of the administration and indeed a member of the cabinet. So, I'm sure he can give you all of the details of why that increase in expenditure was necessary.
Anyway, it is an it is a service which is essential to many residents. I've been asked by many residents who are born in Eastern Europe, West Africa, and the Caribbean how they can better integrate into our community. They want to integrate into our community or into the communities of Stone Market and so on. And as members of council, we are community leaders.
It's our duty to help these people to integrate, not to with to reduce their access to information. We must be helping them.
I'm pleased that I've worked with the Stom Market African Caribbean community.
They need and they've asked for help in integrating their group and it's quite a significant size group into the into various aspects of the community of Stone Market and I'm pleased that councelor Barbara and I have had a discussion about about that. So we will be able to as community leaders, we'll be able to help them to to integrate.
And I call on all of you to do exactly the same thing. Help these people to integrate. They want to. They don't want to be written about. These services are essential. And I'm shocked if the administration feel otherwise. Thank you.
>> Um sorry councelor elders. It's it's not you who concludes this. It's councelor as the proposer of the motion.
>> Uh we've we've now got councelor Bryce.
Three minutes.
>> Thank you, chair. And may I join colleagues across the chamber in congratulating you on your appointment and also on councelor Rock on an absolutely barntorming maiden speech.
Well done, >> Mr. Chairman. I'm astounded we're having this debate today. The term refusing to integrate when referring to some of the most vulnerable in our society here in Suffukk, adults and children, is simply shameful and aborant and a sentiment which myself and I think I may actually speak on behalf of members across here and on this side of the chamber would like to thoroughly distance ourselves from. Utterly shameful that the residents we serve, we are using language such as that.
At the beginning of our council meeting, we heard from our marvelous suffocan focus speaker, the dean of St. Edmondsbury, Dean Joe, and he talked about integrity and care and treading carefully. What on earth would he think about this? As a newly appointed representative and in the education and children services scrutiny committee and former chair of that committee, I look forward very much to better understanding and scrutinizing our newly appointed cabinet member for send counselor to Tony Gould and your views on this. How do you plan to reconcile those views with the residents that we represent and the families that we serve? This sentiment of refusing to integrate couldn't be further from my own views and that is why I am delighted to support your motion today. Councelor Stringer.
>> Thank you councelor.
Councelor Adele Cook you have three minutes to speak.
>> Thank you Mr. chairman and again echo the congratulations that you've been given this afternoon and the way in which you've been sharing this meeting today.
I don't want to put words into anyone's mouth but I do believe that our colleagues across the floor indicated that they were supportive of the principle behind this motion but would not be supporting it because of their interpretation of the motivations behind it.
and the word political game playing was used. And I think I'll concede you're not playing political games, you're just playing games. If you support the sentiment and the words of emotion, what on earth are you doing voting against it?
The fact that people have asked questions should not come as any surprise. You're a totally new element.
This is the brave new future. It's not surprising people ask you questions especially when literature is sent out mainly on a national level and then when localized literature does come out it raises concerns amongst people and I just want to say one more thing not so long ago the leader of this council gave his speech and talked about us approach each other with civility and I've listened this afternoon when a certain selection of people across the way have heckled people on their speech on their feet And the worst example was when councelor Rock gave his maiden speech in this chamber and some very experienced people, people who should know better. You heckled him. He called it chuntering. I think that was good word. I think we need to look at ourselves and decide whether you say when we work with civility. I may never I may never sit down and have cup of tea with you, but I promise you I will never heckle you during this meeting. I will never be abusive or impolite or disrespectful to you. And I would just ask that you think about what you said a couple of hours ago and ask your group to play along with that please.
>> Thank you councelor. I now invite councelor Martin Cook to speak for three minutes.
>> Yes. Thank you Mr. Chairman. This reform leaflet that came through my door during the election campaign mentioning translation services is the very worst kind of dog whistle politics. It completely fails to recognize the myriad reasons why our residents might need to access translation services and the benefits that we all enjoy when they do.
This motion isn't really about the money, but whilst we're on it, why don't the figures presented by councelor Whittle this afternoon tally with the 283,000 mentioned in the leaflet?
There's been an opportunity today for reform counselors to distance themselves from materials that were presumably prepared by their HQ in their name. I honestly thought that they would take the lifeline offered by this motion and move on. But no, Councelor Alders and a procession of others have gone straight for the jugular and sought to justify it. I support councelor Stringer's motion. And those that still don't should maybe just take a breath, reread what it actually says, think about what they're thinking of voting against and the reasons why. There might only be three of us in this corner, but at least we have our integrity intact.
Thank you, councelor. I now call upon councelor Mitage to speak for three minutes.
The motion is your chance to rectify your idea that people don't particularly want to learn English. It has to be foisted on them and that people don't want to integrate. So I would like to know among you how many of you are fluent in other languages?
Fluent.
>> Okay, that's not very many of you. Well done. very good but it's not many of you and we need to respect that even when you can speak a language well you may not be fluent enough at all times you may need extra support for example if there's a legal issue or something most of us um I speak other languages I would need support if there if I needed um uh very complicated things to translate so I I think you should support this motion otherwise you've got to stand behind behind your racist statement and you've got to live with that through the rest of your administration.
Thank you, councelor. Um I'd be much obliged if we could please watch out for um uh using defamatory statements like uh racist in this chamber. Um, councelor Lindsay.
>> Sorry, Mr. Chairman. I think that the member should be allowed to apologize for using that term because it was defamatory and wrong.
>> Mr. Chairman, she said I was racist.
That is defamatory and wrong. Please can I have the member apologize?
>> No, I didn't. Councelor Mituch, will you please withdraw the term racist?
>> I'd like to withdraw the term racist and I'll try and think of a better term and I'll talk to you about it later maybe.
>> Thank you, Councelor. Um, Councelor Robert Lindseay, would you like to speak uh before Councelor Stringer closes the debate?
>> Thank you, Chair, and congratulations.
I gather we all have to say that many times, so must be getting sick of it. Uh so yeah I mean most of the points and I'm grateful to many of the members that spoken because you know most of those points have been made very passionately and very accurately. Um I just want to reiterate the biggest what are these transl these rising translation costs um that presume caused by because people are supposedly refusing to integrate.
The biggest cost is the homes for Ukrainian scheme. Um that's families fleeing an illegal occupation by a foreign power by Russia of their country. Are we really saying that though that that that we're wrong that Suffukk families were wrong to host those people to welcome those people into their homes who are fleeing uh potential death from a from illegal occupation? Um because uh if we are um then then we you know that then all we're saying all the people that are currently over a thousand Ukrainians that are living in this county shouldn't be here and all the families that hosted them did the wrong thing. Um but if we don't if we think that was the right thing to do then we have to provide some translation services for these people.
Um there are lessons councelor Hudson available to these people to speak to learn English and they want to take them but if you've just arrived in the country you can't speak English how do you know how to how you sign up for these lessons you I just looked on the website in the council website they have a whole list of lesson English lessons for Ukrainian refugees but they have to have half the site in Ukrainian so these refugees know what how to sign up in the first place. You need the translation services to get the integration. They want to integrate but they need the translation services. So this idea of refusing to integrate is divisive and wrong. Um the other second largest item of cost after the homes to Ukraine um is the children seeking sanctuary. This council has looked after 397 children the past five years seeking sanctuary. These are unaccompanied children. They're not there with families. They're on their own. Of course, they can't speak English. Uh they want to integrate. They want to learn English and they will, but they need translation services to help them.
Now, in terms of council whittle said, "Oh, the the costs have gone up massively and we need to question that."
Well, the cost you just need to look the costs went up because the homes for Ukraine service only started in 2022 and he cited costs from 2015 2016. But of course they went up because we had an influx of people fleeing persecution. So I'd say to you listen to the dean of St. Edmondsbury.
Um he reminded us that we need to focus on the poor, the vulnerable, the marginalized and the outsiders. That's why we need translation services and why we need to value them. Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor. I now move to councelor Stringer. As proposer of the motion, do you have anything further to add?
>> Oh yes, I do. Three three minutes counselor.
>> Right. Um I just want to address first of all this thing about this motion being a stunt.
>> If this side of the chamber was doing a stunt, previous history will tell you you would know. You would know if we were doing a stunt. The barrier tape would be out. Rooms would be handed out.
You would know if this was this is not a stunt at all. No. This is the first attempt that we have to get any indication as to where you might go when pushed on a particular issue. And I have to say the response is deeply chilling.
It is deeply chilling for various reasons. I've spoken to a number of people on the doorsteps in the last few weeks as all of us have. And I can tell you there are a number of people out there that are frightened and I've been saying look look no. If if the council goes in this direction, I'm sure the services that you use will be protect. We'll do everything we can.
These people wouldn't do that. Of course, they wouldn't. And at the first turn where you're asked to clarify, you're suggesting it's a stunt and we're playing politics. Your leaflet had that phrase on it, refusing to integrate.
Using that cheap dog whistle tactic of trying to marginalize a whole group of people that are in fact a myriad of people with different wants and desires that also is a part of a statutory duty of you and us as a corporate parent for you not to even think that you might want to value it in any way. You could have amended the motion to say we value it as long as the terms, conditions apply, etc., etc., and put a G, but you didn't. You've just come straight back and said absolutely not.
>> I find that personally deeply chilling.
And I will be going back to those doors that I knocked of those concerned people and go, I think we've got a harder job than we thought we had. And I regret that. And I honestly regret that. What's really interesting, I do listen. I've listened to all of your radio interviews and I still don't quite understand what you're going to be doing. You can dismiss that. You have the right. But what I have listened to is what everyone has said today. What everyone has said today. We've heard the minister earlier, the the reverend, which I thought was brilliant, talking about the common good and what a diverse community that we have.
And also one one of the administration said that you would never play politics with children. By not supporting this motion, you are doing precisely that. You are playing politics with children if you don't put some distance between yourself and that phrase that frankly you put into the public discourse for a lectural reward. So I stand by the motion and I encourage everyone that values any part of our translation service to vote yes.
Thank you chairman.
>> Thank you to all the speakers. Uh I now propose that we move to an electronic vote. So, you're voting yes if you support the motion and no uh if you're against the motion.
Please cast your vote now.
On your screen, it's should say that your vote has been cast. Has everybody voted?
I shall now close the vote and the results are in favor 30 against 38 zero abstensions.
Therefore the the motion is lost.
Motion.
Let's now move on to motion two.
This is proposed by councelor Martin Cook and seconded by councelor Colin Kriedwolf.
I now call upon councelor Martin Cook to propose the motion. You have five minutes.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Among the voters that I spoke with during the election campaign, a northern bypass was by far the most frequent ask of Suffach County Council. Jagappa MP's back the bypass petition has now secured more than 3,300 signatures not just from Ipsswitch by the way but from Felix do Maritime from Sax Mundom indeed right across Suffukk and beyond. The port of Felix do depends on functioning transport links with the rest of the country. Countless logistics companies in Suffukk depend in turn on the port of Felix do. When those transport links cease to function, the economy of Suffukk is put in great peril.
The economic costs and risks of our catastrophic traffic problems are clear, but there are social costs as well. I was very much struck by a public Facebook post on the 27th of April. I do not know the author, but clearly he must be um one of our constituents. and he wrote, "Uh, my wife had a hospital appointment today. The traffic was so bad as the Orwell Bridge was closed that we had to walk the two miles to the hospital in hot sun. My wife is 88 and didn't quite make it. I had to fetch a wheelchair from out of the hospital and pull her in the chair the final quarter of a mile. Not something an 81year-old should have to do. That's just one man's story. But every time the traffic chaos descends on Ipsswitch, thousands of people lose work, miss job interviews, miss medical appointments, miss family gatherings, even miss births and funerals.
For far too long, the conservative administration at this council adopted a do nothing approach on our traffic problems. Today can be a fresh start on that.
First of all, this motion seeks to build on the council's resolution last July that a northern bypass should be built.
What hasn't been evid evident since last July are any concrete steps towards making the bypass a reality. This motion also seeks to write that wrong. We know that a northern bypass will be expensive, but such things are possible.
Norwich has a completed northern bypass.
Significant road building is getting underway under Col around Colchester, Chelmsford and so on. We cannot accept IPS switch being stuck in the slow lane.
Much has been made previously of a lack of support for 15,000 new homes needed to help fund the bypass. The reality is the homes are coming anyway. Our only decision is whether we want infrastructure in return or not.
Building a business case which justifies the cost of the bypass based on benefits to the nation, not just to SuffK, on resilience and not just on housing will be vital to us making progress.
Way back in January 2020, the council completed a detailed assessment of 32 options for dealing with our traffic problems. The top five options in that study were all variants of the Ipsswitch Northern Route. bottom was do nothing which is what we've been doing since then.
Second from bottom was a tunnel under the river Orwell. Third from bottom a new bridge.
The next step for this council is to pick up the work that stalled in 2020 and decide a preferred route from amongst those top five options.
From there we need to go forward with submission of a strategic outline business case. These are the crucial next steps to unlocking discussions on funding with government. No business case, no funding, no funding, no bypass.
Got to move forward. We have just 12 months before elections to new unitary councils at which point this council's decision-making powers will very quickly start to drain away. We must take advantage of this short window of opportunity. And for this reason, I'm calling on the council to immediately restart the stalled work and by 30th of September set a deadline for submission of an outlined business case for the switch northern bypass. Mr. Chairman, I move Thank you, Councelor Martin Cook. Um, Councelor Colin Kried, I now invite you to formally second the motion and confirm if you wish to speak now or reserve your right to speak later.
>> I second the motion to reserve the right to speak. Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor. Um, an amendment has been received. The amendment is proposed by councelor Julia Uertitt and seconded by councelor Tony Love.
Councilors have already been provided with a copy of the amendment and the copy is available on the county council's website. Councelor Uertitt, will you formally propose the amendment and I will ask for the amendment to be seconded by councelor Love before we move to your speeches. Councelor Uitt.
>> Thank you, Chair. I I assume I don't have to read it out that that I'm asking you to accept that. Am I correct?
>> Thank you. Yes.
>> Thank you. And councelor Louie. Um I have a Louie. So you and I are going to be I'm going to be calling you Louis from now on because I'm not going to be able to help myself. And I feel today like I've got to be like everybody's mom. So my skirt is very big. Climb in.
>> Thank you, mother.
And I do hope that what I'm going to say will have us all wheel back importantly back to the common good. Chair, members, of those watching this inaugural meeting, today marks an important and memorable moment for Suffach as we begin a new chapter of this county council. In reviewing the motion papers, particularly motion two, I felt a clear responsibility to enhance the motion formally. Strengthening and refining a local highway strategy of national importance is one of the most ser um can I just confirm that you're you're you're um proposing the amendment.
>> I probably got ahead of myself, Chair.
>> Yes, you have. um proposing the amendment and then second the amendment and then it needs to be put to councelor Cook and Cardov where they accept the amendment. Okay.
>> So, we're still going through the process of that. No speeches, please.
Okay. Uh councelor Love, will you formally second the amendment?
>> Thank you, councelor.
>> Before I ask the proposer and seconder to speak to the amendment, can I ask councelor Cook as move mover of the original motion, do you accept the amendment?
No, Mr. Chairman, I do not accept the amendment.
Um, councelor Kried as seconder of the original motion. Do you accept the amendment?
Thank you, councelor.
Right now, we can uh I can ask my mother to uh uh to give her speech. You have five minutes and you're speaking to the amendment. You're speaking to the amendment.
>> Thank you very much indeed. Where were we? So, in reviewing the motion uh papers, particularly motion two, I felt a clear responsibility to enhance the motion formally and strengthening and refining a local highway strategy of national importance is one of the most significant roles this council is entrusted with as it serves residents, commerce, and the tourist industry here in Suffuk. The future of delivering our country's infrastructure begins here.
The outcome belongs to all of us in this chamber and our shared responsibility is to ensure we deliver a solution that is cost-effective, deliverable and carefully designed to work seamlessly for Suffukk. To put that into context, the world bridge carries some 60,000 vehicles a day. And when the route is affected, more vehicles are drawn into Ipsswitch's greater existing roots road system which plays a vital role in keeping the county moving. These routes are essential links to porter Felix Stoke and activity along the A14 and A12 naturally concentrates at key junctions such as that of Coptock and Seven Hills before flowing across the wider network.
a clear reflection of how interconnected our infrastructure is. There's a strong and shared understanding of the importance of this issue. And let me be clear, let me be clear. I would have done this regardless of any party because at the end of the day, this is a big piece of work that frankly shouldn't even be in here today, but I want to make sure we get the best out of it. When the all-wheel bridge is unavailable, the effects are widely widely felt and supply chains slow journeys take longer and the impact reaches far beyond dips switch. This underlines that we are dealing with infrastructure of both local and national significance and it is so closely tied yes to Felix but also to the Freeport and to the larger economy. So, as custodians of Suffach's future, we're making decisions that will shape this county for generations. And therefore, it's essential that the officers the officers who understand this industry are able to consider the full range of credible options available available to us. And this is an opportunity to take a measured and thoughtful approach to look broadly, think ambitiously and fully understand the opportunities in front of us. Let us give those officers the opportunity to expand the scope of the work, test feasibility, examine the evidence and engage widely ensuring that the solution that they select and bring forward to us is robust, deliverable and future facing. That is exactly what this amendment that I'm proposing enables. It allows us to continue developing the northern route whilst also exploring additional options including parallel crossing over and under the ORA alongside modern engineering which those approaches could make quite a difference. Opening up the conversation creates space for innovation. It also allows us to identify new solutions and gives greater efficiency. SuffK has already demonstrated what an an ambition it can achieve. Let's think about the Gullwing Bridge up in Lowto. It's transformed the connectivity and it has opened up opportunities. The freedom of that bridge has given back the community immeasurable new opportunities and time and time was very important. We now have the opportunity to do the very same for to strengthen connectivity and support growth across the south of the county.
Suffukk is evolving, development is increasing and demand on infrastructure is growing and initiatives such as free port east are bringing new opportunities. We have a responsibility to plan for both today and the future.
ensuring that we deliver is is a resilient and adaptable and a really well-built program. As part of that, we should also consider how wider infrastructure aligns our transport network and future energy requirements, including whether the proposed converter station and associated transmission infrastructure should actually be moved strategically and economically located into Felix Free Port. Let me be clear.
This is not an amendment designed to narrow opportunities, but instead reflects a shared understanding of the complexities of this piece of work. The public are looking for and rightly expect us to collaborate as regional politicians to get this right. This is good governance. Today, members, we are shaping a future decision that will influence sufferations.
And this amendment gives the officers and us the opportunity to do so with care and ambition and clarity. Members, I look forward to listening to your debate. Thank you.
Thank you, councelor Uertitt. Councelor Love as second. Uh you have three minutes to speak which you may take now or later.
>> I'm taking >> Thank you. I'm now about to open the debate on the amendment. I would just remind councilors that councelor Cook as holder of the substantive motion may speak for up to five minutes at any point in the debate. Any other counselor including group leaders may speak for up to three minutes each.
If you wish to speak, please signal that you wish to do so and wait for confirmation that your signal has been received by the monitoring officer.
Councelor Mason, you have three minutes.
>> Uh, thank you, Chair. Uh so whenever the Orwell bridge or sections of the A14 become compromised, Ipsswitch effectively grinds to a halt and the consequences are felt far beyond Ipsswitch itself. This is not simply an inconvenience for motorists. It affects freight movements from Felix Stowe, impacts local businesses, delays journeys for residents and can have implications for emergency response times and wider economic resilience across Suffukk. There are two realities.
Firstly, that Suffukk clearly has a long-term resilience problem around the all world bridge and wider A14 network and secondly that any potential solution must be realistic, deliverable and capable of securing wider support.
I generally welcome the amendment uh particularly the recognition that the Ipsswitch northern route represents only one potential solution and that major strategic infrastructure decisions of this nature will shape Suffukk for generations.
We are potentially discussing infrastructure costing hundreds of millions of pounds depending on route alignment. That is why precisely decisions of this magnitude must be evidence-based, financially credible and command public confidence. This debate should not be reduced to for or against a northern route. It should be about recognizing that Suffukk requires a serious evidence-based conversation about long-term infrastructure resilience and economic connectivity.
Now, because the amendment rightly broadens the debate into wider questions of freight resilience, environmental impact, and long-term infrastructure planning, I believe it would strengthen the argument for this matter to receive fuller and more detailed consideration before the council is asked to reach a definitive position.
This important issue cannot be allowed to drift. However, neither should council rush towards conclusions on a matter of this scale without proper scrutiny scrutiny.
An interim report to cabinet setting out the proposed way forward and realistic time scales would in my view be responsible course of action. Therefore, chair under rule 8.3.6A 6A part one of the constitution. I think it's a correct way forward to make this amendment a bit stronger by proposing a small amendment to the amendment if you allow me that refers this matter to cabinet which isn't expressly said in the amendment and for that to be done no later than September.
This would enable a decision of such complexity and magnitude to be accompanied by a full officer report detailing matters such as likely housing numbers, root implications, financial exposure and wider community impacts for a decision of this considerable scale. I believe it is correct and responsible path and one that aligns with article 9.3 of our constitution which requires key decisions to be supported by a full officer report to cabinet.
So councelor Mason you're raising an amendment to the amendment and we're currently in the amendment procedure. We have to deal with the amendment procedure first and for all members to then vote on the amendment and decide whether that becomes the substantive motion as amended and then we go back to the amendment procedure if there's any other amendments. If you wish to then propose a further amendment, you need to prop you need to have that in writing and hand it to the chair and then I have to act then I have to assess whether I'm going to agree whether that amendment is valid before we then go back into the amendment procedure again to amend the substantive motion as amended if passed.
>> Can we please continue with the current amendment procedure? Thank you, >> Councelor Malkei. You have three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
>> There seemed to be much speculation in the press recently concerning Labour's motion on today's agenda with at least one article specifically stating, "I voted for the Northern bypass in the Labor Presented Motion of July last year."
However, that amended motion was not just a vote for the northern bypass as the press suggests, but was a comprehensive list of actions for the council to take to address the congestion issues faced with the closure of the Orwell Bridge. It stated a northern bypass or other interventions should be built and that council should seek government clarification that current strategic transport schemes including the A12 MRN remain funding priorities.
It also acknowledged that progress could only be achieved with cross agency participation working with district councils and suffic MPs to build a consensus for the way ahead.
That is what I support it. The current labor motion does none of that. It defines the issue as being an Ipsswitch traffic concern with a nod to the wider suffic economy and lists the only solution to be the building of a northern bypass. It limits working only with district and burough councils.
History on this issue shows that without cross agency support, there's no business case. In 2019, a detailed northern bypass proposal was created, but sheld when the district councils determined the cost to the countryside too high. Again, last year's motion was not progressed when the Ipsswich MP chose not to attend the meetings SEC officers arranged as directed in the motion. By putting forward their current motion, did the Labor counselors really believe there's a legitimate business case for the government to invest over 500 million pounds to build a road to ease the IPS switch traffic congestion experienced on the occasional days bridges closed.
I will be supporting the amendment as it makes clear the lack of infrastructure investment is not just a NIP switch or suffet concern but a national concern.
It recognizes the need for investment to keep the nation's goods delivered in a timely and efficient way from the UK's largest port. It addresses the pressures put on suffix infrastructure to support the government's positions on energy and housing. is stresses the need to consider all options for the good of suffic not just an IPS switch traffic problem.
I would encourage all counselors to join me in voting for this amendment.
>> Councelor Lindsay, you have three minutes.
Thank you, Chair. Um, and um, thank you, Councelor Huitt, for attempting to make the labor motion more relatable perhaps uh, to some some members in in this chamber. Uh, for my for myself, um, I think I I don't feel I can support this amendment. Uh mainly because we've already been down that it still has in there that we will look again all over again at great expense at the northern bypass. We did this exercise. The conservative administration then administration did this exercise back in 2019.
As I say, hundreds of thousands of pounds were spent uh to draw up a business case, and it was clear there wasn't the support, wasn't the public support. All the people that lived uh north of Ipsswitch do not want a road running past their houses through through the fields. Um it there wasn't any um uh even C councelor Hicks who was then the leader said one of the reasons was we just passed the climate emergency. It would add to carbon emissions and there's no doubt that that's what any new road will do. It will increase the traffic long term. It will not reduce it. The answer to congestion when you if you're talking about cars being rammed in a traffic jam is to persuade people that they can leave the cars at home because we're investing in public transport. We're investing in buses. We're investing in trains. The answer to the freight lries going through Ipsswitch is to invest in in um rail freight. We're still awaiting the money that was promised by the Conservative government uh and is still apparently there although the Labor government have have said nothing about it that was supposed to go into the Holy and Elely uh junction upgrade which would allow far more freight to go from Felix Stow. So all those lries wouldn't need to be on the roads in the first place. So, anything I'm afraid that supports looking again at a failed bypass that we know hasn't got political support. We know it costs half a billion pounds and we know the only way that we can raise the money is to allow much more houses on open countryside. Um, uh, Labour say, "Oh, we'll get the houses anyway." No, this is on top of the houses we're going to get anyway. It's a additional number of houses because the the money from the the developers for the houses that were already planned have to go into other things have to go into other infrastructure support those new houses. If we want a bypass, you need additional houses for that money to go into infrastructure for those houses for the bypass. So, I'm afraid I will not be supporting this amendment. Thank you.
Thank you, councelor. Councelor Tomkin Galvin.
>> There we go. I'm afraid I haven't had time to write a speech, but I have uh thought of a few things to say. First of all, I'd like to thank Councelor Uitt for having the wisdom to propose this amendment. I did find it a bit odd when two motions had snuck into my first session, not knowing how all this works, but here we are. I'd also like to thank everybody opposite us for showing what true collaboration looks like. I've scarcely been able to tell the difference between the four parties this evening, but I think we may have found something that they actually disagree on, which is encouraging, and I look forward to disagreeing with all of you in the future.
As a person who every day has to make a pilgrimage from Ipsswitch to Stow Market, I would very much like a northern bypass every time it is shut.
As a person who has an interest in the continued participation of our country in the global economy, I would very much like shipping containers to have a different way of getting about the country. And so I would very much like a bridge. As a person who likes engineering in general and therefore loves drills, I would also love a tunnel. But in the words of a great musician, you can't always get what you want.
But you might get what you need. And in the words of councelor Hicks, ambition must always be tempered with reality.
And the reality is that the northern bypass, though it is popular with some people, does not have substantial public support. Our glorious MP was able to produce so far, I believe, 3,000 votes in favor. But in 2019, a petition against drew 4,500 votes, which if my electoral mathematics works out is a greater number. And that is the substantial issue. It is not that it is difficult to build a road. We are very good at building roads when we can get down to it. It is really that any scheme to bypass the city will inevitably run into tremendous opposition. And you know while it has been suggested and I actually do agree with councelor Lindseay on the question of rail freight. I think that p personally I think that railway is the correct way to move things. However rather than I would very much like a highspeed three to go from uh our city to the rest of the country as soon as they finished building HS2 but I reckon they may be some time and we may have to throw them a little more money before they are done. So in summary, thank you very much councelor Uitt for the amendment. I didn't want us to be trapped uh with just one option. I don't think anybody wants that. And I think that as a new party with a new administration, it is entirely appropriate that we take the time to consider all of the options that make sense for the people who live here, for the county, and for the environment of that county, which I think we all cherish. Thank you.
Thank you, councelor. Councelor Richard Route, you have three minutes.
Thank you. Um, Mr. Chairman, I think I might be one of the the few people in this chamber who would have supported a the original amendment, b the amended amendment, and c the soon hopefully to be amended amended um motion. Um, I'm grateful to to Councelor Uertitt. Um, although I nearly thought it was councelor Leo Toltoy who who wrote this amendment is is possibly the longest this chamber has has ever seen. So, congratulations. Um, but but I'm I'm I'm grateful actually to see and we've got here eventually in this meeting.
Councelor Hadwin um working across the chamber and I think this is this is where we're at our best um looking at something trying to improve it and then trying to improve it again. And what councelor Mason has suggested this is a long a long-standing problem. it has been stuck in the weeds for too long and we wouldn't want that to happen with um this amendment today and I think therefore his proposal which will come to later to to bring it to a cabinet meeting no later than September is a a sensible one. Thank you.
>> Thank you councelor Councelor Faircloth Mutton.
>> Thank you Mr. Chairman. I too welcome the amendments submitted uh today by councilors and love. I think uh about what my mother told me a few years ago when the Orwell Bridge was closed. It was one winter. I remember I was still working at Willis just down the road and she said to me that's what it was like on Suffukk show day before the Orwell Bridge was built in the early 80s and I thought goodness really is that what it was like? So um we are at a stage where the population has continued to grow.
Your well bridge was opened in the 80s.
The population of Ipsswitch and the surrounding area has grown. That is a fact. That is something we can all agree upon and infrastructure must move on. In my view, being a a proud rural man, I don't want to see arteries of concrete flow across the Suffuk countryside. No, absolutely not. And that is why in the motion proposed by councelor Uitt and councelor Love, it is right to consider all options. Uh, councelor Lindsay does seem to forget that buses use new roads and tunnels. It's not just cars. If people are more likely to get to A and B through a faster network, whether it be buss or cars, they will use public transport as well. They're not simply using cars on these roads and possibly cyclists and pedestrians as well.
Although it does depend what type of uh tunnel is used. Not all can use them.
I think the other thing that the Labor group could also look upon, the most likely source of funding that we could have had with any route improving circulation around IPS, which could have come from the Norfolk and Suffukk mayor that should have been elected on May the 7th, the same day as all of us, but your government shied away from an election on that front. Perhaps your MP Inpswich and indeed the other Labour MPs could ask the government to return our elections as soon as possible for the Norfolk and Suffukk mayor so he or she can unlock that funding for Suffukk, not delay it until May 2028 as you're currently doing. That would be the easiest way of all to unlock funding for this method. whichever route it is, whether it's a route um north, whether it's a route south across the Orwell, whether it be a tunnel, or whether it be a bridge, it is absolutely time that this Labor group takes ownership of that and encourages the government to bring those elections back and unlock real funding that can be attainable. I support this motion. Thank you.
Thank you, councelor. Councelor Matthew Hicks, you have three minutes. Thank Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Um, so I'm just going to talk about the original motion and the current motion in one hit so that we don't come back again. Um, I think the original motion, look, it was a classic play by Labor.
Uh, it was very predictable the first motion they'd bring this forward. Uh we've had a similar motion before on this authority and we have always heard a diverse variance of views on this. I represent an area where some people are really for it, some people are really against it. And what we mustn't do, and I think the danger that we fall into with motions like this, is we're pitting one side of our community against another. We're pitting some residents in our divisions against other residents in our divisions. And we shouldn't take that approach uh when we look at something as significant as this. And I think I'm just going to have to take this opportunity just to look at a few hard facts. There was a meeting held last year, I think, or well maybe actually now it was the year before organized by the Chamber of Commerce on this very really important issue. And at that meeting I attended, the cabinet member attended, the dep the uh the joint chief executive attended, uh Graeme Matier attended, East Suffach attended, Midsuffk attended, the road holage association attended, the Port of Felix attended. You get my drift. It was a really big meeting of lots of important people. James Cartage attended in that building was Jack Abbott MP who did not bother to come and he goes out repeatedly with the Labor group criticizing why is the why is nothing happening on this. But at the real important meetings when we discuss what is going to happen, they do a no show and no showing shows that they're not interested in the facts. They're just interested in a quick headline. And I think and fortunately before the amendment that we had today that's what this motion was doing. So um I think also we need to reflect that the one reason this didn't work and it's been council makai has raised the point was that back then you needed 15,000 new homes on top of the local plan to even consider a business case. Well, now I've heard speculation and I don't have this as facts, but I've heard that could now be as high as 45,000 new homes on top of the local plan. Well, East Suffk and Midsuffk didn't want 15,000, let alone 45,000 homes. So, I think we've got to put this into perspective. And what I don't want to see is some parts of our communities pitted against other parts of our communities on something as difficult as this. So, thank you for the amendment, but I think we need to really reflect on the complexity of this and not turn our communities against each other, which is what I think the original motion was trying to do.
>> Thank you, councelor. Councelor Stringer, you have three minutes.
>> Thank you, chair. Um, yeah, what what an interesting issue. What an interesting play. I I won't be voting for the amendment or anything to do with this until we actually sort out what we're going to do and have a proper strategic get together about what we need to do to achieve the right outcome for all of Suffuk, not just those affected when the road network goes high haywire. I've personally got caught up in that traffic. I've had a one of the worst days of my life caught up in that traffic when I had a a family member in in in awful trouble. Uh and and that was a horrific experience. uh we got through it, but that doesn't mean that we should leap at the first opportunity to make the wrong decision. I'm going to for the first time in this chamber ever uh channel councelor Hudson. At what cost will be all of this? At what cost?
£240,000 was too much for translation services a few minutes ago. This just doing a report on this, you began looking at millions and millions of pounds that you're signing off immediately. I thought you were into every penny should be scrutinized and squeezed. Yeah, here we go. It's five or six million just about to brush out the door by saying yes to this. What we need to do first is make sure that every government who mentions the rail improvements are held to account and give us the check and let's get that sorted out. That immediately takes 98,000 HV movements off Suffach Road.
That's not a huge amount. It's only David Ellie is here. It's only six trains a day, but it's still 98,000 wagons that are not on the roads of Suffukk each year. You need to start with that one first and work out how strategically you can move rail fake through here before you even enter looking at anything like a northern bypass. You need to start looking at your river crossing. When the Dartford Tunnel got too busy, what they didn't do is he said, "I tell you what, we'll get all the councils in London and chuck money in and we'll go to new build a new bridge over at Richmond. We didn't do that. They built another river crossing very close to the original tunnel and they got some of the best engineers in the world to do that for us. That's the kind of solution we need here if we're not going to open the Pandora's box."
And the Pandora's box is just talking about that northern bypass because frankly what that will do, you heard about the housing numbers. You need to be very clear about that in this chamber for another council. I'm the portfolio holder for planning. So I sort of know what I'm talking about. Maybe the original deal was the business case for the Northern Relief Road needed 15,000 homes minimum to get us talking at the table. The unmet need from Ipsswich at the moment we stand here is about 10,000. It could be nearer 15,000.
We already in Midsuffach have 15,000 homes we need to provide in the new up uh housing number from the government.
That is north of 40,000 homes that are going to basically end up in Midsuffk because East is also claiming they might have unmet need at the moment. So we need to be really clear about that. If you're talking about a northern bypass, that is 40,000 houses in midsuffukk. So you now understand why the green run local authority are buying land for biodiversity. It might end up the only fields left in midsuffk if the northern bypass goes ahead. So until we've got the strategic plan that goes rail first, I will not be voting for this. Thank you, chair.
>> Thank you, councelor. Councelor Bryce, you have three minutes.
>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It is as always an honor to represent the good people of Carford, and I'm delighted to have been returned to this place to continue to do so. I stand here as someone who has consistently and unashamedly stood alongside my residents in steadfast opposition to a northern bypass. But let me begin where I agree with the proposed amendment brought forward. Councelor Uitt, we cannot ignore the reality we face every time the Orwell Bridge closes. Whether due to accidents, high winds or maintenance, IPS switch grinds to a halt. Freight from Felix D is delayed, businesses suffer, and the effects ripple far beyond our county.
So, let me be absolutely clear. Doing nothing is not an option. But we must find a solution that keeps traffic flowing and protects this nationally significant corridor. But where I park company firmly and unapologetically is with any suggestion that the answer lies in reviving yet again a northern bypass. This is not a new idea. It's been examined, costed, and tested and in 2020 was abandoned because it couldn't secure support or funding required. And as we've heard, nor was there consensus amongst the districts to accept the new houses. As I've said before and I stand by it today, the Northern Bypass is a concept. It is not a solution. There is no agreed route. There is no credible funding plan. There is no business case that stands up to scrutiny. And today's motion or amendment, I'm afraid, offer any change to that. Meanwhile, the impact on the communities who I represent is real and tangible. It would carve through some of Suffach's most beautiful landscape and leave an irreversible scar, destroying community, rural communities forever. And worse still, it continues to bring uncertainty, anxiety, and blight for residents who I represent in those rural villages. I'm elected to protect those communities as we all are here for our own communities, not place them under threat. We must also be honest. Projects of this scale do not always solve congestion. too often they simply move the problem or make it worse. This is where I welcome the spirit of the amendment because it recognizes we must not restrict ourselves to one option.
There are credible alternatives. The upper allwell crossing was a developed governmentbacked scheme designed to cut congestion, improve journey times within the existing network and it had support.
Investment in rail, Elie Holy, again has support. We can't get it over the line.
These are practical, deliverable solutions, not speculative. Yet the government still won't fund them. So what makes those in support of this motion today think that they're going to fund a northern bypass.
Progress that comes at the expense of our communities and countryside is not progress at all. A proposal of this magnitude requires costed proposals, a sound evidence base, and I'm afraid that I will not be adding my support. Mr. Chairman, I am nothing if I am not a voice for those who I've been elected to represent. Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor. Uh councelor Wellum, three minutes.
>> Thank you, chair. Um, I'm going to vote against this motion, the amendment and the motion because much work has already been carried out in the not too distant past and the conclusion which the clear outcome was that an Ipsswitch northern bypass should not be pursued. The emphasis needs to be on improved rail facilities not on road building. I welcome a study on how best to solve the problems of the transport problems when the the bridge is closed. Uh but I hope that now consideration will be given of the multimodal freight resilience measures. I think that that's the phrase from the amendment, but they need to include how best to increase the amount of freight transported by rail to reduce the effects of diverted traffic in indeed to reduce the amount of traffic on the A-14 uh in its totality.
Most of the containers arriving at the ports of Harage and Felix have no need to use the A14 or the A12 in Suffuk.
the the the multi- whatever it was called resilience measures could include a hub way away from the coast uh to reduce the amount of traffic on the A14.
So please put pressure on the government to bring forward the improvements, the rail improvements at Holy and at Eleach Northern bypass would do nothing for communities along the rest of the A14 corridor, whereas transfer to rail will provide benefits for many communities.
and Ipsswitch northern bypass will increase traffic on the A-14 and other lengths of the A-14, not just around Ipsswitch. And much of the A-14 is already at capacity. Closures of the A-14 to the west of it affects many roads, affects stone market, affects various St. Edmonds and rural areas. Answer northern bypass would take valuable agricultural land have an adverse effect on hundreds thousands of people thousands of residents and add to the problems of the A14 with within suffer the only way forward is to reduce the traffic on A14 by improving rail transport provision and I cannot support any amendment or motion which does not include a real look at how we can improve rail transport through suffer.
Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor. Councelor Patchet, you have three minutes.
>> Um, thank you, chair, and again, um, I haven't spoke to you before, but congratulations. Um I wasn't really going to speak on this one being sort of a newbie counselor um and obviously had not sat in the previous administration um and had not debated this at length which I'm sure it has been in the past.
Um to me it almost sounds like actually we we are almost as a room kind of aligned that we I think we all agree on all sides that there's a problem and that we all want to have a solution.
Okay, so everyone's nodding so yes that's good. Um I I don't know how many truck drivers have we got in here. Have we got any HTV license holders? I cannot be the only one out of 17.
Tristan obviously Bzy. Yeah. So it's all ex-military.
No, you're not ex-military. Sorry. You look it. Sorry.
>> You are. You haven't got HV.
>> No. Okay. Right. So yeah. So HV driver.
So for you know a little bit a couple of years ago I was actually doing a bit of agency driving and I was in and out of Felix docks like four times a day sometimes like five times a day and it is an absolute like nightmare when that bridge shuts. Um so I have been that lorry kicking out diesel fumes going out I switch. So like I know there's a problem and it really does sound to me like we do we do all agree that there's a problem. So this this is just a motion. This isn't a report. So what really this motion is saying is that we should look at some other options, right? So yeah, I agree. So I'm sort of we should look at some other options.
I'm supportive of that and yes, it will cost money, but good infrastructure costs money and we are here to give good infrastructure to the people of Suffuk.
So of course I support it, but I mean I don't I I'm to add another amendment to the amendment to the amendment, but two things scream out to me. Okay, it's not costed. And a few people have said, look, it's not costed. So, I mean, there's the cost of doing the the reports, you know, as Andrew says, that that that's probably hundreds of thousands, maybe millions. Then the actual building the thing itself, and you know, I don't want concrete all around the field. I bet none of you do. Do you Who wants more concrete? Like, no one. There you go. We're all agreed. Look, two things are all agreed on. Um, so, you know, the rail is the good option. Like, rail is if we can put more containers and get them out of Felix though on rail, we're getting trucks off the road. Um, and then if that bridge does shut, then that's less trucks going through. So, I guess the amendment to the amendment to the amendment I was thinking of is we haven't actually considered health in section three. We haven't actually considered any health benefits. The fumes from those trucks and cars going through the center of town, okay, with all that, you know, residual heat, concrete makes more heat. So, actually amplifies all the fumes. So I guess I wonder if the person who made the amendment to the amendment would agree that well on number three when we things we should consider would you please just add the word health to it people's health and then or do I officially need to do an amendment to the amendment to the amendment I don't know but could could we just maybe add someone of the maybe the original amendment could we just add the word health because we need to know how how much like diesel particulate are going through rip switch needlessly. We should be sending that somewhere else. Whether that's on the train or whether that's like a circular route. Um those those diesel fumes really, you know, asthma's on the rise and respiratory things are really on the rise. So, you know, when we do actually look at this properly because it sounds like that's where it's going. Um when we form this report, could we just add public health to it, please? That's like maybe one request cross party. We can all agree we've agreed on like two things. Let's maybe agree on three.
Wouldn't that be a beautiful thing to end on? Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor. Um, councelor Criedwolf, would would you like to speak on the amendment? No. In that case, um, councelor Love, can you make your concluding comments on the amendment?
>> Yeah.
>> Thank you, Chair. I'm happy to s to second this granular exposition laid before us by the independent councelor for sax mandom and district.
It does not preclude nor favor any solution that will alleviate the problems associated with the allwell bridge crossing.
It does include looking at multi-modal freight resilience measures.
It most certainly provides a framework for a prevent preferensic examination of local, national and environmental concerns going forward.
We understand the need for immediiacy.
Felixto port must be a reliable and easily accessible destination because of its importance to the national distribution of imports as an as and also an outlet for exports.
Felix Stowe Port is a major contributor in terms of employment within the town and surrounding areas.
to put its commercial viability at risk would damage the town irretrievably.
Previous administrations have had decades of opportunity to determine and initiate an alternative solution to the Orwell crossing.
It is negligent. They have behaved as though the day to do this would never never arrive.
Now, we are indeed blessed for the time being with two local Labor MPs.
We need them to extract from central government the necessary financial commitments for this important national level strategic project once we as a council have agreed a detailed solution.
This reform council is aware of the urgency to determine and effect a solution and this solution of course has huge implications nationally and for suffuk for decades to come. I second this amendment.
Thank you, Councelor Love. Councelor Martin Cook, um, as the holder of the substantive motion, you may speak for five minutes.
>> Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I know I'm new here, but I was genuinely surprised when councelor Uertitt started speaking from somewhere behind me rather than from the administration side of the chamber. Um, let me give you four reasons to oppose the amendment. Number one, it removes support for the bypass.
Last July, this council resolved that a northern bypass should be built. this motion. My motion sought to reaffirm that decision and set out next concrete steps towards making it a reality. The amendment removes support for the bypass, removes those concrete actions and replaces them with 100% flannel and diversion.
An overong amendment, it only delivers confusion, not clarity. It takes us back, not forward.
Other projects of course have merit, but 100 trains worth of freight go over the Orwell Bridge every single day. Of course, we should maximize the role of rail freight, but Elie and Holy between them only enable six extra trains per day. Councelor Stringer's concerned that we're about to leap to a decision. I think there's no danger of that with this amendment. This is do nothing on steroids.
Number two, it removes protection for bypass routes. Councelor Hadwin was quoted in the Ipswich Star saying that he wanted to keep all options on the table. This amendment removes protection for the top options that were previously identified. This presents a significant risk that these options will be taken off the table for good as a result of bad planning decisions by district councils. If council Hadwin is genuine about wanting to keep all options on the table, then he and his administration will not vote in support of removing commitment B from the original motion.
Number three, it removes concrete steps and timelines.
In removing commitments C and D, which talk about getting work started immediately, building and submitting a business case, the amendment squanders the year that this council has available to it to act. It condemns us to years more of traffic chaos.
Number four, it revisits previously discounted options.
This council completed a detailed assessment of 32 options for dealing with this issue back in 2020. The top five options in that study were all variants of the IPS switch northern route. Bottom was do nothing. Second to bottom was a tunnel. Third from bottom was a new bridge. A tunnel is estimated to be three times the cost of a bypass and still be a single point of failure.
Tunnels and bridges are fantasy options, not credible options.
In seeking to rerun the options assessment that was done years ago, this amendment is an invitation to waste money and sets us back seven years or more.
Mr. Chairman, I used to believe that the very worst thing that could happen to Ipsswitch would be to be part of a countywide authority run by the Conservatives. Turns out I was wrong.
Just like the Conservatives reform are trying to kill off the Ipsswitch northern bypass.
What this amendment tells us is that things will never get better for Ipsswitch while it remains shackled to the rest of Suffukk. And yet councelor Hadwin and his reform administration are hellbent on spending £100,000 of taxpayers money in a desperate attempt to derail LGR and perpetuate this system of local government that continues to fail it switch.
Thank you, councelor. We will now move to an electronic vote on the amendment.
If you support the amendment, please press yes. And if you do not agree with the amendment, please press no.
>> Against all right, I will now start the vote.
Please vote now.
>> Okay, if you're um please ensure that your screen says your voice has been cast.
Has everybody voted?
I shall now close the vote and in favor of the amendment we have 50 against 17 abstain too. So the amendment uh has succeeded and has become the substantive motion. Councelor Mason.
>> Uh thank you chair. I have a very small amend sorry uh I have a very small amendment uh for the chamber to consider.
>> Please could you bring it over? Sorry.
Sorry. Councelor Mason. Councelor Mason.
Sorry. Do you have a second?
>> Yes. Have a second.
Number seven.
>> Number seven.
Sorry. Okay. The um the additional point is that uh under rule 8.3.6 six of the constitution. Uh the matter be referred to cabinet no later than September 2026.
Um first of all I'll ask councilors UT and love uh if you accept that into your amendment.
>> Right. So we can now vote on that.
Um >> that's now the substantive motion.
Substantive motion is now this added amendment. So this is now the substantive motion.
>> Okay. So the substantive motion um now has councelor uh Mason's addition uh appended to it. And so we're it becomes the um uh substantive motion with that with councelor Mason's inclusion. Um and We can debate we go to debate or they can go to a vote.
>> Okay. You you have um two options.
Either we go straight to the vote uh or we have a debate on the amended amendment. Straight to the vote.
Straight to the vote.
So do all councils know what they're voting for, please. So we're it's um sorry councelor Mason.
Do I not get an opportunity to speak on the amendment? Sorry. Do I not get an opportunity to speak on the amendment?
>> Uh I I I'll try and keep it brief. Uh okay.
>> Just out of interest, I did want to say it in the chamber. I was particularly moved by councelor Rice's uh uh comments. Uh I I totally understand the impact these infrastructure projects can have on our countryside. In fact, in the west of the county, I'll speak on it on another day, uh, New Forest City is not a rumor. Uh, 400,000 houses, a million people, doubling Suffach population is being proposed. So, uh, I certainly understand the fears and concerns of residents in rural settings and h how things can change the uh, just the landscape of where we live. I I did want to reiterate the reasons why and I don't want to undermine the amendment actually at all but I I saw it as a slight tightening uh because by not mentioning it going to cabinet and asking for an officer report to go to cabinet for all the options to be considered I I I felt that that was an emission and it just makes it a little bit tighter and I think uh in speaking to the original amend amendment by saying no later than the end of September. It gives the discussion that report and cabinet that sense of finality of this isn't going to drag on.
Uh so I won't I won't speak anymore. I'm not looking to massively change the amendment. It's very small. Just making it a little bit tighter and time limited. Thank you, Chair.
>> Thank you, councelor. Does anyone else wish to speak?
Councelor Lindsay, go ahead. Three minutes.
>> Uh, I'll be very very quick, but I what I wanted to say and missed out, so there's an opportunity to add in another point is that there is nothing in this.
If we're looking at all the options, we should be looking at options for switching people from motor vehicles to cycling, walking, and public transport.
And that that's not in here. here. I know we've got this multimodal blah blah blah, but we need to look at that option and that's not in here. So, I still won't be supporting the amendment of the amendment. Thank you.
>> Thank you, councelor.
Councelor Uertitt, as proposer of the motion as amended. Amended. Amended. Um, do you have anything further to add? You have three minutes.
>> Thank you, chair. First wanted to say this is the first time I've spoken in here as a counselor. I've had the privilege of sitting on the health and well-being board for the district. It's a big deal pulling something off so quickly and I'm so sorry that I've missed aspects for councelor Lindsay. I did my best. I also work with the team and I thank you very much for your time this week because I learned a great deal. I learned councelor stringer that actually you don't have to pay so much because their feasibility savage to the greater extent are done. We've only got to look at new aspects and with you both being involved in planning it seems from the middle from m middle uh suffk and also leading east suffukk county uh district council you should be able to add up how many houses are going to be built on that northern bypass. You don't have to worry really councily because you can't actually get it through currently.
So, what I'm saying is what I'm saying is what I'm saying is I watched it and I I really app I would appreciate you doing this. I'd like you to go back and look at the YouTube film of when the last administration had this debate. It's really worth learning. I enjoyed it. However, can I say that back in July of 2025, find it on YouTube. That's how nerdy I am because it's really important to get the facts right. We've got a bunch of guys here who are ready to go. They're just going to have to pull it together.
They've been talking about it for such a long time. So, Labour, I'm really sorry, but we do need to look at the bigger picture. And when I keep hearing that Jack Abbott hasn't turned up, that's really not, you know, it's rather compromising, isn't it? Can I thank you very much, Conservatives, for helping me today with all the nuts and bolts and thank you for the amendments because I'm just on the learning curve. I feel like Bridget Jones doing this, let me promise you. and and Greens I've said what I need to say and gentlemen over there so you can imagine what it's like my political advisor says to me Gina it's all about numbers if you want to get this through you have to do the numbers well who's got the biggest numbers hello so Monday morning I find Tony love and Tony love and I stood in the 2019 election and I know Tony being a Felix do counselor you just want the best and we all want the best we want the best for Suffukk we want the best for Ipsswitch and we want the best for our offices because they are ready to Thank you very much for your time and I appreciate your support.
Councelor Strength.
>> Yeah, chairman, with your indulgence, I'd just like a uh an item of personal clarification. uh house building. Uh Midsuffk has the most housing growth of any council in the country and it has done for the last three years. So I don't know where you're getting the idea that somehow we block housing there. We are the greatest amount of housing of any council in the country. We are way above our current target. It's too much.
It's nearly a thousand a year. But we so you know what we're trying to avoid is that that bow wave of housing being built becoming an absolute avalanche.
Thank you councilors. We'll we'll now move to the vote.
Do not touch anything on your touch screen yet.
If you support the motion which is the substantive motion plus the amendment and the amendment amendment uh please vote yes and if you do not agree press no and uh abstain if you wish to abstain. Are you all ready then?
>> Sorry sorry sorry clarify whether we are voting on the latest amendment or the whole kabuk or just the latest amendment.
as amended.
>> Yes. Motion two as amended.
>> Right. This is motion two as amended.
>> So in that in that case before we move to that mo that vote may I move um an additional amendment and it's very strange.
>> We haven't voted.
Okay, >> it's closed.
Close the debate.
>> Yes, the the debate is closed. We'll now move to the vote and I will start the vote.
>> Please please vote now.
>> Why is it closed?
>> Have you cast your vote?
Has everyone voted?
I shall now close the vote.
And the results are 50 in favor, 14 against, two abstensions.
>> We did not vote on the Wasn't one. It was It was accepted.
>> It's accepted.
>> It's accepted.
>> Okay. The motion is therefore carried.
>> Thank you everyone. Uh please wait for the gavl. Uh-u before you leave your seat. Counselors, can you please take all belongings, paperwork, and any rubbish with you? Please place your microphone smart card in the collection box by the meeting room exit and return your name plate to the table outside the meeting room where you collected it from. Finally, remember to check your pigeon hole before you leave today.
>> Sorry, the council is still speaking, please.
>> So, that uh concludes the business for today's meeting. Thank you for your particip participation and I wish you all a safe journey home.
Well done.
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