卢比奥在中国接受的采访完整版，系统讲述美国对中国，台湾，伊朗和其他问题的政策立场，以及他会不会竞逐总统（中文字幕）

追加: 2026-05-18

[00:00:00]Mr. Secretary, we thank you so much for your time.

[00:00:02]>> Thank you.

[00:00:02]>> I do want to start by asking you, are you surprised that you're even here in China as a US senator? You know, you were sanctioned by China because of what you said talking about China's record when it came to human rights abuses. You have never shied away from that.

[00:00:16]>> Do you still feel the same way now that you're in this country?

[00:00:18]>> I mean, the difference is my job now is no longer just to be a senator. My job is a different job. I'm the chief diplomat of the country and I execute on the president's foreign policy. The second thing I would say is irrespective of that even in my time in the Senate I would always acknowledge that the United States and China have to have a relationship. It's the two largest economies in the world probably the two most powerful militaries in the world and I think it's irresponsible for us not to have direct dialogue with them and areas where we can find mutual cooperation. I think we can there's probably virtually no problem in the world that we can't solve if we work together on there's but with two big powerful countries like this there's always going to be irritants. there's always going to be areas of disagreement and it's our job for the sake of our respective countries but ultimately for the worlds for the sake of the world to try to manage those areas of difference um you know they've got red lines and things they never want to talk about and that they but we have them as well and and our job is to do and promote the policies that are in the best interest of the United States.

[00:01:13]>> So for our viewers at home there's so much going on in the world and and the world is watching what's happening here.

[00:01:18]What's the main takeaway you can tell our viewers at home? What was negotiated? what's been decided, how is it going to change their lives back in America?

[00:01:25]>> Well, first and foremost, I mean, part of the problem we face in the United States for a long time is we've allowed our nation to be de-industrialized. If you think about factories, manufacturing, all kinds of key industries that have left the country, lithium batteries, that's something America invented, and China now dominates that market. So, I always said it, and I always said it when I was in the Senate, China's doing what I would do if I were Chinese and I were a Chinese leader. They are trying to dominate the world in all these key industries of the future.

[00:01:51]We may not like it, but that's what they're going to do because they're acting in their best interest. We have to act in our best interest. I'm the secretary of state of the United States and before that, as you pointed out, a senator for the United States. I work for the president of the United States.

[00:02:02]Our job is to promote the interest of our country and to bring back bring back as many of those industries as possible.

[00:02:08]So, the areas we're always going to be talking to them about is unfair competition. Um, you know, the their control of critical supply chains.

[00:02:14]There's so many critical supply chains that we are reliant on, but not just us, the world overly reliant. So I think what you'll see as a result, two things I think are resulting today. There is some agreement they're going to buy more of certain things which is important like American airplanes, American jet engines, but I I think the the other thing that's important for us is to keep up the work of re-industrializing America, bringing back to the United States those industries that are key to us. The Chinese aren't going to like it because they want to dominate those industries, but that's what's good for the American people. The second point is just that engagement between the presidents of the respective countries is critically important because they were able to talk about the straits of Hormuz. We were able to talk about um North Korea. We were able to talk about all these other parts of the world where China plays a role as well.

[00:02:57]>> So just to nail down some specifics here, we're talking about the purchasing of airplanes, Boeing airplanes, and then also there's been some reports about beef as well. Is there anything you can you can shed light on that?

[00:03:06]>> I think the details will be announced later today. I don't want to get ahead of the actual announcement by the trade representative, but there's going to be some agricultural purchases which are important and they're important for our growers and and China needs those things. We hope in the future to expand it to energy purchase. You know, the United States is a net of supplier of energy now of the world. We're one of the world, if not the world's largest energy supplier at this point. Um, obviously when it comes to the airplanes and the engines, those are American factories and American workers that are making that. And so, anytime you can gain access to a market as large as this one, that's a very positive thing. But there's a lot of work yet to be done.

[00:03:38]>> The CEO of Nvidia is here with you guys.

[00:03:41]He traveled with the president on Air Force One. Were AI chips discussed at all >> uh in the context of the president's conversation with President G. No, we didn't get into the level of specificity. We know what that is. I mean, at the end of the day, the United States remains a dominant player in the space of AI and in the space of of semiconductors and chips. That said, you know, the Chinese are investing billions and billions of dollars in their own industry. So, that's going to be an area of competition. Do you think AI chips should be sold to China?

[00:04:07]>> Well, I think as you've seen the president's announced that certain chips can be sold. Obviously, it's up to the Chinese to accept it. But I I think we always have to establish our area of dominance. In essence, the cutting edge, the things that give us an advantage. It would be dumb and stupid for us to sell that to anybody, especially a country that's going to reverse engineer it and leaprog us. So, I think that's understood. Maturely speaking, there are things the United States still has dominant position in. And from our national security perspective, we should keep that dominance. We want to keep that dominance. the Chinese are going to do their best to catch us and even surpass us. We shouldn't make it easy for them the way we kind of did for 20 years when we sort of had a different view of this relationship.

[00:04:42]>> Yeah. I want to read you something. Uh your counterpart, the foreign minister has put out a statement which you may have seen, you may haven't seen. I want to make sure you you hear about it. He says, quote, "Taiwan independence and crossstraight peace are as irreconcilable as fire and water.

[00:04:58]safeguarding peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait is the biggest common denominator between China and the US.

[00:05:04]And again, the context of all this is that President Xi stressed to President Trump that the Taiwan question is the most important issue in China US relations. Talk to me about that moment when that >> Well, they certainly feel that way and and they always raise that issue and we understand they raise that issue. From our perspective, any forced change in the status quo and the situation that's there now would be bad for both countries. One of the things the Chinese emphasize, which we agree, is strategic stability in our relationship, a constructive relationship, but also one that establishes strategic stability so that we don't have misunderstandings that could lead to broader conflict. And so we always reiterate the point. We hear them when they say this. We always respond by saying anything that would compel or force a change in what we have now would be problematic. And uh we would certainly our policies on that have not changed. It's been pretty consistent across multiple presidential administrations and remains consistent now. Did President Xi request to President Trump not to sell weapons to Taiwan?

[00:05:57]>> Well, that topic uh may have been has been discussed in the past. It did not feature primarily in today's discussion.

[00:06:03]We know what their position on that is already. Remember, Congress plays a role in that in that process as well. And uh we have sold them weapons in the past.

[00:06:10]That's existed as recently as December, which they were very upset about. And that's a decision the president gets to make. As Congress appropriates and as Congress decides what to do with those topics, we will respond accordingly. But nothing has changed in the way the US views the relationship with Taiwan. It will defend Taiwan as has been >> yeah US policy on the issue of Taiwan is unchanged as of today and as of the meeting that we had here today. It was raised. They always raise it on their side. We always make clear our position and we move on to the other topics. We know where they stand and I think they know where we stand.

[00:06:40]>> Do you think China wants to invade Taiwan?

[00:06:42]>> Well, I think China's preference is probably to have Taiwan willingly, voluntarily join them. In a perfect world, what they would want is some vote or a referendum in Taiwan that agrees to fold in. I think that's what they would prefer. Um, ultimately, it's featured prominently in President G's uh mandate. In the time he's been in office, he's made clear that what they call reunification, that's what they call it, is something that has to happen at some point. We think it would be a terrible mistake to force that through force or anything of that nature. It would there would be repercussions for that globally, not just from the United States. And we kind of leave it there.

[00:07:15]That sort of ambiguity is what I think uh has defined our charact the way we've characterized this issue and the reason being strategic ambiguities. We don't want to see conflict. We don't want to see something disruptive happen because I think it would be very disruptive for the world and for both countries.

[00:07:29]>> I know you're watching China. You don't think they're ramping up their military to do something in Taiwan?

[00:07:34]>> Well, I think they're ramping up their military in general. I mean I I mean the the the pace of growth in the Chinese military over the last 10 years has no precedent. None. I mean just what they've done with their navy alone over the last they put billions and billions and billions of dollars in their system.

[00:07:47]So it's you know you look at it it's hard to ignore how fast and how big. So I don't think it's just limited to Taiwan. I think they have ambitions to ultimately be able to project power globally the way the US does now.

[00:07:58]They're not they're still behind us in that regard. But there's nonetheless they are investing a lot of money. They are right now the world's second most powerful military without a doubt.

[00:08:06]>> Let's talk about Iran. Did President Trump raise the issue of Iran with China? He did. And and and and it was important because the the Chinese side said they are not in favor of militarizing the straits of Hormuz and they're not in favor of a tolling system. And uh that's our position. We don't we we will never support an Iranian tolling system in the Straits of Hormuz. Nor do we think they have a right to put mines in international waters. And so it's good that we have alliance or at least agreement on that point. I think the fundamental question is what are we going to do about it? We have a resolution now before the United Nations that in which hund and something countries have co-signed the Bahinis are the sponsor, but we're strongly behind it and been pushing very hard on it and it very clearly makes those points. So, we hope the Chinese will vote for it.

[00:08:47]So, right now we haven't gotten their commitment to vote for it yet at the United Nations. Maybe that'll change after today's meeting. I don't know.

[00:08:52]>> Can you help me understand what exactly did President Trump ask President Xi for when it comes to Iran?

[00:08:57]>> He didn't ask him for anything. I mean, we're not asking for China's help. We don't need their help.

[00:09:01]>> But he raises the issue. We raised the issue to make clear what our position is and to to make it clear so they understand because I'm I mean it's logical we would talk about it given how dominant that issue is our position is very clear Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon and that's what they were you know they were trying they were on the verge of building a conventional capability where they had so many rockets so many drones that you couldn't do anything against them they would hide behind that conventional shield to do whatever they wanted with their nuclear program in the future that's why the president chose to act in response to that Iran has decided that they're going to take an international waterway and turn it into theirs and and charge tolls for it. We're not going to allow that to happen. And that's why there's a blockade. It's a direct result of what they've done. So they're if everyone's ships can't get out, Iran's ships can't get out. They can't be the only one that benefit from it. And I think on the issue of tolling and on militarizing in essence what Iran is doing, the Chinese side today was was very clear that they oppose that.

[00:09:53]>> What they oppose exactly what >> they oppose what Iran is doing. I mean they oppose the militarization of the straits and which an international waterway and they oppose charging a toll which is what Iran is claiming to try to set up. They want to set up a system where ships have to pay Iran to use an international waterway and now they got to do something about it. They should vote for our resolution at the UN.

[00:10:12]>> Does China agree with the United States that Iran should not have a nuclear weapon?

[00:10:16]>> I Yeah. And what they've said is that Iran is signatory to the non-prololiferation treaty and so therefore they should not have a nuclear weapon. And they reiterated that point again today. Maybe not as forcefully as I'm making it, but they've certainly reiterated that in the past. Today wouldn't it wouldn't the first time.

[00:10:29]>> So, the US and China came to common ground with the fact that they both don't want Iran to have a nuclear weapon. I just want to make sure we're clear.

[00:10:36]>> Yeah, but let me be clear on this. I don't there's a I don't know if there's a country on the planet. I don't know about North Korea, but I don't know there's a country on the planet that is in favor of this regime and Iran having nuclear weapons. I don't know of any. I think the difference is we actually are trying to do something about it. Other countries are against it, but they're not willing to do anything about it. So I think the Chinese simply reiterated what has been their position in the past which is that they don't want to see them have a nuclear weapon. The Russians would say the same thing. Certainly all of their Gulf neighbors would say the same thing as well. I think the difference of course is we're actually trying to do something about it.

[00:11:06]>> You know for our viewers back home in America >> every day Americans are spending more and more >> and they're saving less and less. How do you explain to them why is this taking so long in Iran? Well, first of all, I would say obviously it may seem like a long time from from the perspective of other conflicts that we've seen in the past. It's only been weeks, not months, and certainly not years, >> but longer than the president has told the American people.

[00:11:27]>> Well, we achieved the missions of Epic Fury. We destroyed the There is no Iranian navy. There is no Iranian navy.

[00:11:32]They have small little speedboats with a machine gun on it, but that's not a navy. They're actual navy. And they had a they had a navy. They had a navy that had carriers on them. Not aircraft carriers traditionally, but the ones that could launch drones from those things are completely gone.

[00:11:44]>> I understand. But the straight is closed. There's still uranium. Well, the Straits the Straits are closed is is their reaction to the aftermath of epic fury. They decided they're going to take the world hostage. And my point is what they're doing now with the Straits, they would have done once they acquired a nuclear weapon or once they built their conventional capabilities where they could hide behind to a certain level.

[00:12:02]Understand what I'm saying by this? If you have 20,000 missiles, you can't possibly shoot down 20,000 missiles. I mean, they would overwhelm your systems.

[00:12:10]Once they establish that point of immunity, not only could they hold the world hostage with a nuclear program, they could hold a world hostage with the Straits. It's not the first time they've tried to control the Straits. And what they're doing is illegal. It violates every law on the books in terms of international law, which all these countries in Europe love to talk about.

[00:12:26]They have militarized the straits. They are threatening to sink commercial vessels that don't pay them a toll.

[00:12:32]That's unacceptable to the whole world, not just the US.

[00:12:34]>> Will Project Freedom return? Are we going to start bombing Iran again? The reason why Project Freedom stopped was at the request of Pakistan. And they said, the Pakistanis said, "If you guys stop Project Freedom, we think we can get to a deal." And and so in the interest of diplomacy, the president would prefer to have a diplomatic solution to this problem with Iran. We went ahead and and agreed to stop it. By the way, we agreed to stop it. We had destroyers inside the Persian Gulf. We said, "Okay, we're going to stop. We're moving our destroyers out. They get fired upon by the Iranians." And that's the activity you saw last week. We still prefer, the president strongly prefers a diplomatic solution. We're going to continue to try to work on one. We've given this regime and Iran every opportunity to reach one. But part of the problem we're having, frankly, is they're divided internally within Iran.

[00:13:16]They're divided internally and it makes it hard to get counter proposals from them.

[00:13:20]>> On that point, is the new Ayatollah part of any part of this negotiations? Do you have any evidence? Is there any understanding that the new Ayatollah is active in advising Iranians leadership?

[00:13:31]Well, I think what's clear is that the people we're negotiating with, like their foreign minister, is not the decision maker. So, he has to go back to their system. Now, whether that's a council or supreme leader or what have you, it's not clear, but he goes back to someone and gets approval for what he's allowed to agree to and what not to agree to. In many cases, the feeling is we are negotiating with someone who then has to turn around and negotiate with someone in his own system and his own country. So, oftentimes it takes four or five days to get responses from the Iranian side. That's been an impediment here. It also I think is insight to the weakness of this regime at this point and what they're facing internally. But nonetheless, we're going to keep working at it because we'd like to see a diplomatic solution. That is our preference. I'm not going to talk about what the options that the president has.

[00:14:11]He has options to do other things if these diplomacy fails. But we're going to give diplomacy every chance.

[00:14:16]>> How much longer are Americans wait?

[00:14:18]>> Well, I won't put a timeline on how long it'll take to reach a diplomatic solution. We want to reach one. I think what has to happen irrespective is the straits have to be reopened. Understand once again just to reiterate what they have decided is there's this international waterway. It doesn't belong there. But does that happen without Iran's cooperation? Can that happen?

[00:14:34]>> It can happen one of two ways. It can happen because the world and either Iran decides to do it or the whole world decides to impose a cost on them for what they're doing. And the whole 100 something countries at the UN have signed up and said we are against what they're doing. I think the job now is to get them to actually do something about it. Are they willing to diplomatically isolate Iran? Are they willing to impose sanctions on Iran to force them to remove those mines and stop shooting at ships that are going through the straits? Because let's be clear, it's hurt our consumers. There's no doubt about it, okay? We are not immune to global oil prices at some point because we do buy from the global market. But other countries around the world are paying a much higher price. They have as much or more to care about the straits than we do. We got they've got to get involved in this as well. As the president was leaving for China, did he make a mistake when he told a reporter that America's financial situation isn't playing quote even a little bit of a role in his motivations to make a deal with Iran?

[00:15:26]>> No. I think what the president is claim is that Iran's not going to use that as leverage.

[00:15:30]>> Doesn't that sound out of touch though?

[00:15:31]I mean I mean Americans are spending so much for gas >> because I think what the president is making clear is that we're not going to let Iran use that as leverage. Think about what the Iranians are thinking.

[00:15:39]The Iranians and they watch this.

[00:15:40]Remember there's no free press. There is no you in Iran, right? There is there is no press in Iran that can criticize the regime or say, you know, create any pressure on them. And I think what the president's making clear is if the Iranians think that they are going to, you know, use our domestic politics to pressure him into a bad deal, that's not going to happen. We've taken extraordinary measures uh to keep gas prices lower than they are in some other parts of the world. And they will go down. Those straits will be open and we will see those prices go down. And actually, I think you're going to see a dramatic reduction in oil over time because all of that pent up oil that's being held hostage by Iran, once that reaches the marketplace, it'll have a very positive impact. But I would also say there's a price attached to a nuclear Iran. If Iran ever acquires a nuclear weapon, they will immediately what would stop them from controlling the straits then and then forget about it being a three-month or a six-month problem. It could be a permanent one.

[00:16:31]>> I want to turn to Cuba now. The State Department just re-uped the offer of a hundred million in aid to Cuba. Cuba's foreign minister says that's an absolute lie that there is no money coming. Are there any strings attached to that hundred million dollars in aid?

[00:16:44]>> The only strings attached is that they have to be distributed by non-governmental sources like the Catholic Church. I was at the Vatican last week. I spoke to the Catholic Church again. They're willing to play that role.

[00:16:53]>> So what's the hold up? Cuba's lying.

[00:16:54]>> Cuba their hold up. They're Yeah, they're lying. They lie all the time. Um I mean how can he say it's not a real offer? We've made it to them privately.

[00:17:02]We're not making it public. There's a hund00 million by the way. We've given them humanitarian aid after the hurricane. We provided them $6 million of humanitarian aid. 3 million of which was distributed. 3 million of which is still being held up uh but is available for them. Now we're saying here's a hund00 million of humanitarian aid. So I don't know if they watch your broadcast in Cuba, but if they are, the Cuban people should know there's a hundred million dollars of food and medicine available for them right now. And the only reason it's not reaching the Cuban people because the only string attached is it has to be distributed by non-govern. I don't want non-governmental organizations. This can't be humanitarian aid that the government steals for itself.

[00:17:39]>> In a year, will someone named Danel or Castro be in charge in Cuba?

[00:17:44]>> I don't know. I hope not because if they are, then Cuba will probably not have prog progressed.

[00:17:48]>> But is there still a plan for changing Cuba?

[00:17:50]>> Sure. I mean, look, the change in Cuba is their economy doesn't function. It It's not a functional economy.

[00:17:54]>> No, I get that. But the US plan, though, understand the US plan.

[00:17:57]>> Well, I wouldn't tell you exactly what our plan is because I don't want them to know what our plan is. But our plan for Cuba is a prosperous future. That's what we want. It's in our national interest and to have a prosperous Cuba, not to have a failed state 90 miles from our shores. So, how do you have a prosperous state where people can succeed?

[00:18:12]Understand Cubans, you know this, you understand this as well as I do because of where we come from. Cubans are successful everywhere in the world except one place, Cuba. And and so that's what we want. We don't want We want Cubans not to have to leave that island in order to be successful. But they can't because the current model they have is it's not just a it's broken. It doesn't work. and it'll never change as long as the people that are there now are running it. They are close-minded, unfortunately. I hope I'm wrong. I would love for them to come to their senses and say, "Okay, we we recognize this really has to change and it has to change big." But right now, they don't seem to be indicating that.

[00:18:43]They seem to be digging in.

[00:18:44]>> I have only a few more questions. I think we're getting close to time, but uh and I'm going to be honest with you because I because I have the timer here.

[00:18:50]Um I I do want to ask you, um going back to China, did the president bring up the case of Jimmy Lie? the president always raises that case and a couple others and um obviously we'll hope to get a positive response from that but and you know some of these things are best handled outside of the spotlight but it was raised those issues are always raised in our meetings.

[00:19:09]>> Would the US provide a safe haven for Jimmy Lie if China were to release him?

[00:19:13]Could he come to the United States?

[00:19:14]>> I think we would like to see him released. The president's made that point publicly and in other meetings. Uh we hope the Chinese system will be responsive to that and we'd be open to any arrangement that would work for them as long as he's given his freedom. It's really at this point a humanitarian situation because of his age and health.

[00:19:29]>> Yeah. 78. Two more questions. There was a a tweet that went viral. It was put out by communications uh staffer Steve Chung. It it showed you in a Nike tracksuit and it said that you were on Air Force One wearing the Nike Venezuela gear or something to that effect. I think you know what I'm talking about.

[00:19:46]Was that Was that Was that some type of >> No, it's a trying to send a sign. What's the context for that?

[00:19:51]>> There's no context. It's a nice suit. I mean, I like it. It's comfortable. It was the same one Maduro was wearing.

[00:19:55]>> It is. But you know what? He copied me cuz I had it before. I don't know when he bought his. I don't even know that was his. The bottom line is that that's a suit that uh it's comfortable. I don't know. I There was no message. I didn't even know he was taking the picture.

[00:20:06]>> Okay. And then finally, I don't know if you were watching the president on Monday, but he was at the podium and he was maybe making a joke, but he was surveying the audience. And I know you're Secretary of State. you don't like to talk about your political future, but he asked a group of supporters to clap if they liked Vice President JD Vance or if they liked you better. Sounded like it was pretty even.

[00:20:25]What do you think about that? Would you want to be president?

[00:20:28]>> No. Look, I'm f and I know this is going to sound like a typical job. I'm going to be in this job for the next two and a half years. That's I'm going to do that job. I'm going to finish the job for this president. I'm enjoying it very much. Uh I think we're going to make a lot of good things happen. JD is a very good friend of mine. If JD runs for president, I think he'd be a phenomenal candidate. I've said publicly and I'll say it again. I'll be the first person to sign up and support him. I think JD would do great.

[00:20:48]>> Would you want to be a vice president?

[00:20:50]>> I want to be the Secretary of State and I'll worry about the future in the future. I'm not saying, you know, I'm not telling you that that's what I'm aiming for. You know, I've been doing this for a long time, too. I was in the Senate starting in 2010. So, I'd like to do some other things with my life at some point, although public service is an honor to be able to be involved in.

[00:21:05]>> Okay. Um, I do want to ask you because we did so much reporting on Chinese EVs.

[00:21:08]There's there's two arguments against Chinese EVs in the US. One from automakers. it'll the industry because they're so cheap. But elected leaders have also said it's an issue of national security. Do you truly believe if China if China's EVs come to the US, it's an issue of national security?

[00:21:24]>> Yes. Because it'll wipe out an industry.

[00:21:26]But it's not just the EV, it's all of the other things that go into making them, the the all the other components of it that are related to other industries as well. But ask the Europeans. The Europeans right now, their EV model, they're being flooded with Chinese EVs. it is wiping out their industry over there. So again, we already have a lot of critical vulnerabilities. There are already things we rely on in our economy where we get 95% of it or 85% of it from China. That's a vulnerability we can't continue to allow it to expand to other fields.

[00:21:55]>> Yeah. Mr. Secretary, we thank you for your time.

[00:21:57]>> Thank you. Yeah.