"This Debate Got Heated: Explaining Tariffs to a Trump Supporter"

追加: 2026-06-02

[00:00:00]James, go to take it away. Tell us why you support the worst president of your life.

[00:00:03]>> Well, I don't know that I'd call him the worst president of my life, but I would I would strongly um vouch to say that the left side doesn't agree with the things that he does because he makes the hard decisions without their consent.

[00:00:17]>> Can you give me an example?

[00:00:19]>> When When I had brought to you the fact >> Yeah, well, I I can agree with that, but I think he does it for the right reasons. Now, when I stumbled across your live, you were talking about tariffs, and I could see how that could be frustrating to you guys, but he was doing it for the right reasons.

[00:00:35]Therefore, we were paying more for to other countries, and his end goal was to get us paying the same across the board.

[00:00:45]>> Oh my goodness.

[00:00:46]Are you talking about the trade deficits?

[00:00:48]>> Yes, yes.

[00:00:49]>> Do you know what a trade deficit is?

[00:00:52]>> A general idea.

[00:00:54]>> Can I Can you give me like your general idea of what a trade deficit is?

[00:00:56]>> I'm talking about like, you know, they make stuff and for our country, we have to pay to get it over here, and uh compared to >> you just answer Can you just answer the question? Can you give me like a general idea of what a trade deficit is?

[00:01:09]>> That's what I was trying to do.

[00:01:10]>> Oh.

[00:01:11]>> So >> I'm sor- sorry. Sorry.

[00:01:13]>> Yeah, no, no, no, you're fine. So, like products that they make or make stuff for us that we sell, but like we have to pay that price to get it over here, and the sales price, and then vice versa us to them, and the whole tariff war, from my understanding, was the fact that for [snorts] them, we pay them more, and but the stuff that we make for them, >> Okay.

[00:01:37]>> they pay us less. And so, from my from my understanding, Trump's whole tariff war was to equal out the board, so we're not getting the short end of the stick.

[00:01:47]>> Okay.

[00:01:48]So, um I think there's three main reasons why people are Trump supporters.

[00:01:55]Um >> Okay.

[00:01:56]>> misinformed, evil, stupid.

[00:02:01]All right? I I think that you're kind of falling in that first bucket because that that's not what a trade deficit is at all. All right? You're just like misinformed on the nature of his economic policy leading you to falsely think it's a good thing even though it's not. So, a trade deficit is when we buy more goods from another country than they buy from us. All right? And when you say that Donald Trump is going to implement all these tariffs to reduce the trade deficit, well, first and foremost, a trade deficit isn't a bad thing. And in fact, it's actually a signal of a good thing sometimes. When we are the richest >> countries?

[00:02:33]>> Well, I think that that's a natural expectation given that we're the richest country on the face of planet Earth.

[00:02:37]Clearly, when we have more money and more people than Oh, you're one of those people where you just like to give your money away. Wait, can I give him a specific example really quickly? Can I just try to finish explaining this concept and I'll happily pass you the mic?

[00:02:48]Um so, just to quickly like put a bow on it.

[00:02:52]We would naturally expect when we are the richest uh and uh one of the largest countries with 340 million Americans to buy more from a country like Canada that's a bit more poor and a bit smaller than us.

[00:03:06]Why? Because we have more people and we have more money.

[00:03:09]Like like clearly, we're going to spend more on Canadian goods than Canada spends on American goods. And you're saying, "Oh, you're Oh, you're just one of those people that want to give your money away." No. No. When we give money to another country, quote unquote, no, we are spending our money on goods produced by companies in that country.

[00:03:28]So, it's a transaction. It's an exchange of money for goods.

[00:03:34]>> Okay, I understand that, but why is their goods or valuables any more valuable than ours? If we're selling the same stuff, but why are we paying more for theirs?

[00:03:42]>> don't. Well, well, that's that's the other issue. So, there's a there's a diverse ecosystem of of goods that are produced and sold in various places across the world, okay?

[00:03:52]And even if a a similar good is produced uh in in two countries, well, then you're still going to see differences between those goods because like take Canada for instance, they just focus more on uh infrastructure for lumber, right? So, they produce significantly more lumber than we do. So, because they have a significantly higher supply of lumber in Canada compared to America, well, then the lumber that we could buy from Canada is going to be for significantly lower cost than the lumber we could buy from any American producer.

[00:04:17]So, for that reason, of course, American companies are going to opt to buy the lumber that's required for the raw material to be able to build their goods, houses, construction projects in America compared to an American company that's going to pay them more. This way, they're able to pay maybe more to their employees, they're able to hire more employees, they're able to sell their goods for lower costs to Americans, and this is simply the dictate the dictation of the natural of the uh of of of of the market.

[00:04:39]>> Okay, and I can agree with that, but just because they're a smaller country and are looking to do well for themselves doesn't mean that I have to pay more for them. They're not part of our country and they're not part of my family. My job's to provide for my family. Why would I want to pay more money for other people?

[00:04:56]>> well, see, the thing is is the natural market would dictate that if there would be some incentive to buy lumber from a Canadian company company compared to an American company, it would like cost less or be of a higher quality. So, you're not like doing charity work here like buying Canadian lumber. No, this is just the economy. It's It's going to be the fact that the Canadian lumber costs less than the American lumber. It's of a higher quality. It's what you want because of your individual subjective preferences. Like you just have like a fundamental like a misunderstanding of the basics of like transactions and uh capitalism.

[00:05:29]>> Oh, well, I get what you're saying. If it's higher quality, then yes. I mean, a $400 car should be better than a $10,000 car. I I get what you're saying.

[00:05:38]But all every we were in a position to be literally getting the short end of the stick by every country out there. We were getting That's not a That's not a There's no short end of the stick that is received there. There Like, I I don't I don't know what you mean when you say short end of the stick. There's no way that we could put it in a Like, under no scenario, okay?

[00:06:01]>> So, would we be buying the same >> No, no, listen. Under no scenario would we be buying the same amount of goods from Canada as Canada is buying from us.

[00:06:10]Listen, I'll make an analogy, so it makes more sense to you. Then, I'll pass the mic to Santanelli. It's very simple, okay? Follow this.

[00:06:18]We have two people, okay? And these two people like to buy and sell things from each other. All right? Person number one is somebody like Elon Musk. They're a billionaire. Person number two is somebody like you, me, Denisha, Santana, or like most people watching the stream.

[00:06:36]You know, doing all right, average American, whatever.

[00:06:41]Or maybe doing a little bit better than the average American. Maybe even you're a multi-millionaire. You got some money.

[00:06:45]Regardless, the the point is is that you definitely don't have billions of dollars.

[00:06:50]So, who do you think is going to buy more? Is person number two, the average American, going to buy more from person number one, the billionaire?

[00:06:57]Or is person number one, the billionaire, going to buy more from person number two, the average American?

[00:07:04]>> I'd say the billionaire.

[00:07:05]>> Right. The billionaire's going to buy more from person number two, the average American. Is there anything unfair about that? Like, obviously not. That's just what we'd expect because a billionaire has more money, right?

[00:07:16]>> But, if the billionaire buys in mass >> could we could we just agree that there's nothing unfair about that? Like, that's just what we'd expect because the billionaire has more money. Like, maybe there's something unfair about being a billionaire to begin with, but there's nothing unfair about the notion of a billionaire buying more goods from a non-billionaire. Just They have more money. They have more means to buy more goods, right? There's nothing There's no short end of the stick in that equation, right?

[00:07:37]>> Yeah.

[00:07:38]>> Okay, well, in the real world, when we're talking about trade between two countries, okay? America's like the billionaire and then for instance Canada is like the African-American. Like Canada, okay, has a significantly lower GDP than we do. They on average, not even on average, every single year they spend like significantly less than we do. So, we have more money and we spend more money. For that reason, we are going to buy more goods from Canada than Canada buys from America and there's no problem with that. There's nothing unfair about that and there's no shorting of the stick involved in that.

[00:08:11]Just to clarify, am I making sense?

[00:08:14]>> Yes, you're making 100% sense, but you're saying America is the billionaire. That's false. It's us people on the ground, us little people.

[00:08:22]I mean, that's that's what I'm talking about.

[00:08:24]>> talking about the American GDP and the way that it works in our country. I honestly, I'm just going to say really quickly, I think you just don't understand economics. Like seriously, uh Dean gave a great example. Let me give a really quickly specific example.

[00:08:38]There is a small African country called Lesotho. I know I'm messing up the name, but we have a trade deficit with them and the reason why is because they actually we import diamonds from them.

[00:08:51]Like that's the number one thing. We actually import about 50% of our diamonds from there, right?

[00:08:59]>> Mhm.

[00:08:59]>> The biggest thing that we actually export when it comes to materials is fighter jets, right? But see now their GDP is less than $3 billion a year. So, they can't buy the same amount of fighter jets from us as we can buy diamonds from them. So, they're going to have we're going to have a trade deficit cuz we can afford their diamonds, but they can't afford our fighter jets. So, do you think we should punish that country for not being able to buy fighter jets from us even though we are buying their diamonds from them, which FYI guys, I'm not championing blood diamonds. I'm just giving a real world example, but do you think that I we should actually like penalize them because they can't buy our fighter fighter jets?

[00:09:41]>> I wouldn't say that we're penalizing them or punishing them. I mean If they can't if they can't afford it, that's them. That's their country.

[00:09:50]>> Okay, but so should they just not >> So there's nothing unfair about a trade deficit, right? There's there's no issue with trade deficits, right, dude?

[00:09:58]>> Depending on what side you're on.

[00:10:00]>> Can you can you give me an example of like Like I got Listen, I really listen, I I appreciate you for coming up here and being a kind guy. But like I it It's hard to have a conversation about economics with somebody that doesn't understand economics. How about this?

[00:10:19]>> Just don't understand.

[00:10:19]>> Let's just see. After after everything I described to you, after everything Santana described to you can you repeat what the definition of a trade deficit is?

[00:10:28]>> I understand perfectly what you guys are saying, but >> Okay, can you tell us what a trade deficit like this is like the pop quiz after class. What's a trade deficit?

[00:10:36]>> Your guys's view of it is the fact >> No. No, no, no. Not our view. Not our view. What is it?

[00:10:41]>> Yeah, what you said is that other countries are smaller than us and it's not fair for them.

[00:10:46]>> No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm just asking you to tell me what a trade deficit is. I'm not asking you to do an evaluation of the fairness of trade deficits. I'm not asking you to do an enumeration of why trade deficits exist.

[00:11:00]I'm just asking you what a trade deficit is.

[00:11:04]>> It's the deals we make with other countries and the cost for them to us and vice versa.

[00:11:10]>> No. No. No, no, no, no, no. See, like this is a thing. This is a thing. I I told you what a trade deficit is. I gave you an example of a trade deficit. I explained to you >> Yeah, yeah. Like >> Okay, okay, listen. Just repeat after me.

[00:11:24]Repeat after me. A trade deficit okay, is when we buy more from them than they buy from us.

[00:11:32]>> Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah.

[00:11:34]>> Okay.

[00:11:34]>> My bad. I I backtracked a little bit, but yes. Yes, [clears throat] I'm on the same page.

[00:11:37]>> FYI, there's countries that have trade deficits with us.

[00:11:41]>> Right.

[00:11:41]>> Yeah.

[00:11:42]>> So, so why is a trade deficit a bad thing? Wouldn't we naturally expect us to buy more from other countries than they buy from us because we're the richest country in the face of planet Earth?

[00:11:53]>> I mean, if it if it's something we want to buy, but like I said, back to your trade deficit >> But everything we buy is something we want to buy. There's There's no like forced transactions here. Like Like I hope you understand here that no one's like forcing us to buy all this lumber from Canada, but just simply American companies and American consumers do because it's higher quality and it's cheaper. Right? Like there's no There's no There's no mechanism of force. We're just consuming. Right? Like no one forces you to consume Netflix. No one forces you to consume chips and pizza.

[00:12:22]No No one forces you to consume a new watch. No one forces you to consume a second car or third home. It's It's just the natural demand of the market.

[00:12:31]>> Mhm.

[00:12:32]Okay. I I mean, I get that, but what if What if I wanted to buy lumber from Canada? Why should I have to pay more when I'm not a billionaire? Do you get what I'm saying though?

[00:12:41]>> What if you wanted to buy lumber from Canada? Then go buy lumber from Canada.

[00:12:45]That's the thing. Like you You have that option.

[00:12:47]>> Also, you do also understand that if you were individually doing that, you have the ability like even while Donald Trump is levying like these tariffs, there's a a large proportion of black farmers who have directly been able to work out trade deals with Canada cutting out the Trump administration as far as how they have to do things so they don't directly get impacted by the tariffs. So, if you're a small business owner or a direct business owner, you have the ability to actually have those loopholes that are presented by the countries as well. So, like you have that ability.

[00:13:21]>> I didn't know that. Um >> Yeah.

[00:13:22]>> But can you go back to describe I just I just want to go one step at a time. You made some analogy about you buying lumber from Canada as it relates to like a trade deficit. Can you repeat that example? I I didn't understand it.

[00:13:35]>> So, I'm not a billionaire. Why should I have to pay extra? Do you get what I'm saying? So, you were saying >> should you have to pay extra for lumber from Canada? Are you asking why should you have to pay more for lumber from Canada? Right, that's the question?

[00:13:47]>> You're No, listen, listen. You're saying >> Is that the question or is that not the question? Are you asking me why should you have to pay more for lumber from Canada? Is that the question you're asking?

[00:13:57]>> I'm trying to form the question. You're saying that billionaires because an example, America is like a billionaire and they should buy or pay more because they are like so and I'm saying >> Oh my god, no, that wasn't the example that I gave you at all. No, no, no, no.

[00:14:14]The analogy was if we have a billionaire and an average American that just like to buy and sell things from each other, we just naturally expect for the billionaire to buy more from the average American because they have more money to buy [ __ ] with. They have more purchasing power. That's all. I never said that the billionaire has to pay more. I never said that the billionaire has to pay point blank period. They could like just choose to not consume goods from the average American, but I'm I'm just simply saying that they'd probably buy more, right? Because they have more money. I'm saying buy more, not pay more, buy more.

[00:14:44]>> Okay, I see. I'm I'm on track.

[00:14:47]>> Oh, okay. Okay. But, would you say it'd be unfair for you to have to like pay more for lumber from Canada just because it's from Canada?

[00:14:55]>> Unfair to pay more?

[00:14:56]>> Yeah.

[00:14:58]>> Um It depends. Is it different for everybody else?

[00:15:04]Or is it going to be the same price across the board?

[00:15:06]>> Well, we're just unfairly making the price more expensive. Not for everybody else, but specifically for Americans.

[00:15:12]>> Yeah, that's unfair.

[00:15:14]Why should we pay more?

[00:15:17]Yeah, but is it was it >> That's That's what That's what's done That's what Donald Trump's tariffs are doing.

[00:15:23]>> Yeah, for now, but didn't he >> A tariff What do you know what a tariff is?

[00:15:28]>> A tariff is him upcharging, I believe.

[00:15:32]>> What?

[00:15:32]>> Until a deal is made.

[00:15:34]>> No, do you just know what the Do you just know what the definition of What's the definition of the word tariff?

[00:15:39]>> I don't know the exact definition.

[00:15:41]>> Then why would you argue it?

[00:15:43]>> My friend, a tariff is a tax on an import. An import is something that you buy from another country then bring into the country you live in. All right? So, a tariff is something that make that makes goods from other countries more expensive for us and just us cuz like our the tariffs aren't going to impact what Canada sells to Mexico or China or Europe, right? Like just [clears throat] just us. So, when you're telling us that you think it's like unfair for us to have to pay more just because we're American, well, then you completely disagree with Donald Trump's tariff policy cuz that's exactly what it does.

[00:16:20]>> Yeah, but his end goal was to lower the tariffs. Yes, it may rise the tariffs for now or I mean all that.

[00:16:26]>> We're paying those. We're paying that price. I just got a shipment this morning that I couldn't get unless I paid the tariff on it. It's a $150 tariff today.

[00:16:35]>> True. Also, if if if if its goal is to like raise that is to lower the tariffs, you understand that he could just do that?

[00:16:43]>> Mhm.

[00:16:44]>> Like it doesn't it doesn't it doesn't take strategy to lower tariff. It just takes a order.

[00:16:49]>> Wait, Dean. Dean. No, no, no. He literally did that. You remember around What was it? Thanksgiving when he reduced the actual tariffs on some of the things he had levied because the grocery prices were too high for the holiday. He literally did that.

[00:17:03]>> Yeah, listen.

[00:17:05]If my if Listen, if I have a plate of dinner in front of me and my end goal is to eat everything on that plate, would it make any like sense for me to like toss half of it in the garbage first.

[00:17:19]>> I mean, no.

[00:17:21]>> Right? Cuz I could just eat everything on the plate. So, if Donald Trump's end goal is to reduce tariffs on other countries, it doesn't make any sense for him to increase tariffs on other countries?

[00:17:32]>> Mhm.

[00:17:33]>> Cuz he could just reduce >> is so >> Why Why does he have to increase tariffs on other countries to reduce tariffs on other countries? Why does he have to do that?

[00:17:42]>> Because they wouldn't make a deal with him.

[00:17:44]>> It It doesn't require Listen, it doesn't require a deal. It doesn't require any like cooperation from another country to reduce our tariffs on them. Because tariffs are our policy, not not theirs. Not not not shared policy. Not not not like international policy.

[00:17:59]>> charge us.

[00:18:00]>> Uh-uh. So, tariffs are trying to get down.

[00:18:02]>> So, So, they don't charge us tariffs.

[00:18:04]They charge themselves tariffs. Tariffs are paid by the people who buy them.

[00:18:06]>> Exactly.

[00:18:07]Exactly. Like, that's the whole point.

[00:18:09]And Dean has been driving this home. You You don't understand economics. You don't understand tariffs. You just think it's a good a good idea because Trump has been saying that. But, like, Trump doesn't understand tariffs either. He just likes the words.

[00:18:21]>> Yeah, listen man. It's not a good thing.

[00:18:23]I you you I I I'm going to be honest.

[00:18:26]You are too uneducated to have this conversation. And because of that, I'm going to end the conversation here.

[00:18:32]I feel like we've given you really good like like scaffolding to work off of to like further like your own education on like the subject matter.

[00:18:40]So, if if if you want to like go pursue independent research on economics, I'd I highly implore you to. I think that everybody should know the basics. I think that's a good thing. But, we're not going to continue this debate, okay?

[00:18:52]>> Yeah, okay.

[00:18:53]>> Also, you should probably look into our trade deficits that we have with other countries cuz not only do we export like fighter jets, but Hollywood, that's a big export.

[00:19:03]One of the quick thing, Dean, if you Yeah, the National National Agricultural Law Center talks about the uh way that farmers have the ability to um trade internationally to avoid tariffs, but it's like a whole big deal.

[00:19:20]You have to actually know what you're doing. Um but I'm going to get out of here cuz I got some things to do. I appreciate you having me up.

[00:19:25]>> Appreciate you coming up, Santana. Have a good rest of your day.

[00:19:28]>> Thanks.

[00:19:28]>> What's that, Denisha?

[00:19:30]>> Oh, I just said bye, Santana. I also want to say super quickly, nobody's expected to know everything. So many things happen in politics. It's such a vast subject, if you will. But if you don't know something, it probably shouldn't be the cornerstone of why you vote for someone.

[00:19:44]>> What? Right. Really good point. I loved your common sense. I really do. Yeah, what a what a good way to word it, right? Like no one's expecting like the world's every like every American voter to know the intricacies and nuances of economics.

[00:19:57]But like if you don't even know the basics, definitely don't like vote because