Is Alberta Still Free If Ottawa Controls Everything? | Maxime Bernier on Alberta Independence

Added: 2026-05-22

[00:00:00]All right, good day everybody and welcome back to the show. So today our special guest is Maxim Bernier. So Max as many of you know has been on the show a number of times and somebody I've come to very much respect as I've known him now for my goodness it's 2018 and uh very consistent individual in his beliefs as many of you know and the policies have never changed around the people's party of can Canada. So he is the founder of the PPC and was for those of you who don't know a former member of parliament in the Steven Harper era and was a cabinet minister prior to that had worked in banking and law and regulations. So no uh stranger to politics. I want to welcome today Maxim Bernier.

[00:00:45]>> Hello Nadine. I'm very pleased to be with you. Thank you very much for having me. Oh, Max, it is always a pleasure.

[00:00:52]And I feel like I haven't had you on enough lately. And so now that things are kind of shaken up here again in Alberta, what an amazing time to have you back.

[00:01:02]>> Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's happening in Alberta right now. There's a lot of discussion about your future.

[00:01:09]>> Absolutely. Uh Max, before we get into Alberta independence, though, I want to broaden the conversation a little bit and I want to talk today about a couple of different things. I want to discuss the Emergencies Act and how the government actually found that to be unconstitutional.

[00:01:25]Um, and now we have a federal government that's appealing that. Um, I do want to touch a little bit on the policies of the People's Party of Canada because your policies when I ran for you in 2019, 2021 and Senate, um, they just aligned with Alberta so beautifully. And then I also want to chat a little bit about what's going on with our indigenous groups and because all of this really boils down to like major constitutional issues and I think what I want to get from you today is that the tough truth around is Canada actually fixable.

[00:02:04]>> That's a huge that's a huge question.

[00:02:06]Absolutely. Yeah.

[00:02:08]>> Yeah. So why don't we start with you know some of the basic things that we've seen coming out of the courts um and when we can start with you know the emergencies act uh if you're comfortable there and anything else you want to throw in and then of course maybe jump into a little bit around the indigenous because you're seeing an injunction here in Alberta um by our indigenous groups you know you want to talk about anti-democratic but then you also see it in BC where literally the federal government as well as the provincial government under UNRIP are just handing over property rights.

[00:02:42]>> Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. What's happening actually right now in BC under the property rights. Uh it's a shame because we said that eight years ago that you know property rights it's the most important rights in our constitution.

[00:02:59]But here in Canada we don't have that in our constitution. It's uh but anyway we have property rights in this country.

[00:03:06]But what I want to say is that's the UN again with UNRIP the UN UN nation declaration on indigenous people. uh what happened in BC it's as you know Nadin the BC government decided to integrate that treaty in their legislations and now they have a lot of problem with that and the court in Canada were very happy to say yeah you know the indigenous people in BC they have a right they have a kind of a property rights and you have the federal government who is doing nothing and now you know that will be in front of the supreme Supreme Court of Canada. Uh it's a very challenging because if you own a property or if you have a business over there in BC, uh it can be difficult for you to have a mortgage or to have a loan for your business uh based on your property rights. Uh because it's uh unsecure right now. Um and our position was clear as a national political party.

[00:04:12]We said that you know we must the federal government and our government must not sign that treaty with the UN and the federal government did it. So that's why the provincial government in BC was able to pass a legislation and put that in his legislation. So you don't have that uh challenge here in Eastern Canada in Quebec, Ontario or other provinces because they didn't do what the NDP BC government did by having a legislation and putting a real direct reference to that treaty coming from the UN. So our position is the same. We need to withdraw from that from the UN. we the federal government and that's the solution for that.

[00:05:02]>> Now Max, do you think that there's some contagion here though? Because I know Alberta is like, "Well, we have treaties." Quebec is like, "Well, we have treaties." But um some people have some concerns, myself included, because you know, the government, even the federal government is talking, you know, it's not about asking or consultation anymore. It's consent. And you know, when I I just finished an interview with Sean Buckley and we talked really frankly about the Constitution and you know the the monarchy's role and how you know the king truly is still the uh the chief and in command really of Canada.

[00:05:40]Um how does all this play into some of the other provinces like including Alberta?

[00:05:46]Yeah, but the fact that if you speak about the property rights in BC, why we don't have that challenge here in Quebec or in Ontario or Manitoba, uh for me, it's because we the provincial government did not pass a legislation to be sure that the province will recognize and will will um will um delegate their responsibility on property rights to the UN.

[00:06:15]So that's why we don't have that conflict here in eastern Canada. But what we have also it's uh the fact that the engineers people here in our country the first nation in our country uh you know with these woke governments the one in at the federal government and in other provinces what they are doing is you know everything needs to have an authorization with the first nation for any project. So that can be very challenging and as you know like we can speak about pipelines nine also. So now you know you have to you need to have the approval of the first nation to be able to have a pipeline that will cross different provinces and you know but the fact that we don't have a a new pipelines in this country right now it's because the federal government does not use his constitutional power under section 9210 and you know declaring a a project like a pipelines project for the national interest of our country. If the federal government can is doing that and if he decide that it will do that by passing a legislation and saying you know this pipeline going from Alberta to BC is under the federal jurisdictions and like that you know first nation won't be able to stop that or BC won't be able to stop that. So we have a federal government in Otawa that is not using his constitutional power to be sure that we have national infrastructures being done uh here in in our country. And on the other side they are giving they are saying to the UN you know our our relationship with our first nation will be based on the UN uh declaration on indigenous people. We must not do that.

[00:08:14]We did sign treaties in Canada with our first nation in the past and these treaties must be the one that we must respect, not the UN.

[00:08:24]>> Now, Max, why I mean I I'm trying to get to the fully understand why our government is doing this. Why it is that, you know, less than 3% of Canada's population is now dictating to the other 97% what projects can be built, what projects cannot. So in in your opinion like we've seen you know Justin Trudeau and all the theatrics around the mass graves for example in Colona only to have that indigenous group themsself come out and say no graves have been found you know and and but yet the the theater around all of this there has to be some sort of political reason for the the Liberal party um and the government in power to be doing this like provide us with some insights that you think you know why >> but but First, you know, we know that the federal government is not serious about, you know, the the understanding that they sign with Alberta, uh, you know, after I don't know how many months, maybe a year right now, and you have nothing concrete done. So, the federal government is not serious about that. Is doing that only to appease uh the your province, Alberta, and and the government, Daniel Smith government over there. They're not serious about that because if they were serious they will have used section 9210 in our constitution. So why they don't want to do that? Because they still believe that in climate change they still you know want to they don't want to promote any uh other energy than uh than hydro electricity and sun and wind and all that. So for them the the the oil and gas industry is a very dangerous industry and they don't want to do that.

[00:10:13]So now they're buying time by saying an agreement with Daniel Smith. We know right now there there's nothing concrete and at the same time they can appease their radical leftist environmentalists because nothing is done.

[00:10:29]>> But Max, I mean it doesn't make any sense. We're seeing the end result of the climate change hysteria that went on and the policies, bad policies in Europe. Europe has bankrupted itself.

[00:10:42]It's destroyed its economy. Um, you know, now, I mean, it's destroying its agriculture. Whatever is left is just not performing. And yet, we have Canada that has adopted the same policies and doing the same things. I mean, people used to say to me that, you know, well, the government has more information. it it's you know the reason that it makes these decisions but I don't understand why we're destroying our own productivity our own um you know and not maximizing the the the use of these resources that we would been so blessed with not only for Canadians but for the rest of the world like why would we say no to a pipeline to Germany >> yeah you know it's a shame it's a fact that you know and we we are actually right now maybe in a recession we have that huge inflation. We have a huge deficit. We need to promote project that will give us more resources and more prosperity. And the federal government is not doing its best to promote that. Why? You know, that's still a leftist. Look at what Carne is doing. I thought I I must admit nine that in the beginning the first couple of months of the carne government I said to myself maybe it would be better than Trudeau but it is not the deficit is bigger the debt is bigger than it was uh they are only spending money that we don't have creating always new agencies at every time it's a government bureaucratic um decision and they think that you know they know better they are building all these agencies to spend money and to dictate to the free market what is good what is not. So, and you're right, speaking about Europe, Europe and Germany right now and France and UK, they are moving and and they know that what they did, they destroy their their country economically.

[00:12:37]But here in Canada, it's the same like during COVID 19, you know, why did they impose that vaccine that was not safe and effective and we know that right now we thought and now they want to apologize for that. They It's like business as usual. They want to turn the page. They're doing the same thing with the oil and gas industry. Um, you know, and the the worst here in Canada are official opposition is in line with that with all that climate ideology. You know, all these carbon capture and all that. We're spending billion of dollars to capture carbon. And CO2 is not a pollutant. It's a gas essential for life. Piev is in line with that like carne. So the fact that in Canada we don't have a strong opposition elected in parliament that is fighting against these crazy ideologies and crazy policies. It's why maybe we are late in Canada when you look at what is happening in Europe right now. Well, I mean, every time I look at, and it's not just, you know, uh, the federal policies, I see it at the provincial level. I'm seeing at the municipal level, you know, greater and greater spending as, to your point, more and more agencies. And I want you to comment on the most recent one that Carney has developed. This idea that Canada is going to have a heritage fund and they are borrowing $25 billion even though we're $80 billion, you know, this year in deficit spending and 1 point some odd trillion in debt. Um, you know, this it was different when Alberta started a heritage fund, when we had a surplus.

[00:14:21]Norway started a heritage fund, it had a surplus. But yet people in and and I'm going to say this mostly in the east it seems and with this liberal mindset believe the words without understanding what it is that this man is actually proposing. Like can you break this down for us? Like I look at this I know you know I know this is not a heritage fund.

[00:14:43]This is another infrastructure bank where you know we're going to invest in Canada. It's all politics and it's all about votes and look over here while we do this over here. But share some of your insights on that.

[00:14:58]>> You're right, Nen about that. You know, it's a we have a deficit that will cost $25 billion for what putting that and the prime minister is telling us we will attract big investment in this country.

[00:15:11]So that's corporate welfare. you know, if you if the private sector has a project and if that project is, you know, um in line with and profitable, they will go ahead and do it without money coming from the federal government. But because of our bad, uh economic situation, a lot of regulations, uh taxes that are high for businesses, taxes, corporate tax, and also I must add capital gains tax. So it's not attractive for a business to invest here in Canada. What what the government is doing instead of deregulation, instead of putting in place less regulation, deregulation, instead of abolishing the capital gains tax, instead of having a flat tax on business to be able to attract these investments here in Canada, they're they're not, you know, no fiscal reform.

[00:16:10]Everything is good. Yes. you know, it's not the best place to invest in Canada, but we will help you business people. We will give you money and you know, if you want to invest in one project, maybe the federal government will invest also.

[00:16:26]That's not the solution because like you said, we are not building anything. And the government will dictate to private sector what it's good, what it's bad.

[00:16:37]the government will choose you know who's the winner who's the loser and that in a capitalist society that's you know and we must be proud of that you know in it's it's not working it won't work it will take maybe a year or two to build that new agency and after that you know the deficit will be bigger I don't know how many investment they will try to to attract here in Canada tried to have with that. But I can tell you all these project that will be um based on that new farm they will come in Canada because they in fact they are not profitable. If they were profitable we don't need to have a fund like that without any money. It's borrowed money and I don't I didn't see anything from the global mail or the national post against that. They are saying, "Oh yeah, that will bring econom economic wealth."

[00:17:40]But I I don't I don't see that. Yeah, I'm like you. It's crazy to do that when you are in deep in debts like we are here in Canada.

[00:17:51]>> I'm of the opinion that we just need to get the government out of the way. And the government's doing the exact opposite. They're growing. They're adding more departments. They're adding more and more layers. And worse yet, even on the housing affordability, you know, this idea that um somehow the government can do what the private industry can't. I I'm like inefficient, ineffective. So, and worse, they're now going to compete for the building of homes with people who are actually doing something, being productive in society, building homes, developers who are developing land and preparing it for. I I I don't understand the direction that this government and and of course Carney came in. So many people believed his rhetoric about him being a central banker and his connections, his relationship with Trump. And I I want to get your take here on the um the comment that was made at the Liberal convention just recently because rather than fix the problems, you know exactly where I'm going with this. Rather than fix the problems and for the government get out of the way, what they've said, you know, for those young men and women who have studied, they've worked hard, and they've made the decision that maybe they need to go to the United States to make something better, we're now going to charge them $500,000 to leave.

[00:19:04]That was crazy. You know, you're successful and you're very great. We want you to stay in Canada. Stay in that jail in Canada. You don't don't have the right to go and work in in another country. If you want to do that, you'll have to pay a fees or you'll have to pay a new tax.

[00:19:24]Uh that's crazy. If you want to keep your people, just build an environment when they will stay. you know, we are losing our bright people and entrepreneurs who are looking at the country right now and saying, you know, there's no future in this country. I there's, you know, if I'm working hard, I'll pay a lot of taxes. Uh, I cannot afford a I cannot afford a house. if I'm starting my my career. So, if you want to keep your good people and Canadians in Canada, just change the environment, the fiscal environment first. And but they're not doing that. And that proposal, I I hope that the federal government won't do it. But you know just the fact to speak about that and and put that proposal on the table that is showing you that where they are you know they think that the government can solve every problems but the government is the problem you know they cannot solve more government more taxes less freedom that's what we are we are living in a country like that today >> so Max is this why we're seeing the rise of so much discontent with the provinces. And you know, as we've talked earlier about Alberta independence, it's not just Alberta. I mean, Quebec's independence and separation has been rebirthed. Uh you've got Saskatchewan, you got parts of BC, Newfoundland and Labrador has an independence movement.

[00:20:56]Um and and I I personally believe because I you and I worked in finance, you know, a lot. You're looking always at patterns. You're looking at trajectory. Which direction are things going? Canada is not moving in the right direction. Or am I wrong?

[00:21:13]>> Well, you're right about that. And Canada is not moving in the right direction for the last 15 years. And that's that's why, you know, it's so hard for everybody. We have that inflation. And they're telling us, oh, inflation is because of, you know, uh the the price of gas is going up. But bas inflation is because we have these huge deficit and the the we are paying for these huge deficit that the federal government did the last 10 years and we are paying by the inflation tax and so right now people cannot afford to buy a house. Uh it's very you know the price of food is going up and we have these government that are spending and spending. But the problem is not only the federal government. The problem is provincial governments also they're spending money that they don't have and altogether you know the uh the debt to the GDP in Canada it's around 95%.

[00:22:13]So when the federal government is telling us oh you know I can't borrow I can't borrow because interest rate are low and you know the the the debt the the debt on on the the GDP is only about 40%. But that's not true because you need to add municipal government provincial governments and the federal governments and all together it's about 95%.

[00:22:37]But you know the interest rate were low couple of years ago but they may go up.

[00:22:42]So the more borrowing it's a it's not a success for economic growth and our government are doing that all across the country provincial and your government in Alberta it was supposed to be the more fiscal responsible government in Alberta and Danielle is doing a lot of big deficit also there. So they don't have the courage to tell the truth to Canadians that it would be a tough time.

[00:23:11]We need to stop the spending. We need to balance the budget. We need to cut all the money that we are giving to foreign aid, to corporate welfare, big corporations like they gave another $250 million to Ukraine. Actually, not to Ukraine. Our government will buy ammunitions from the US and giving that to Ukraine. So it's, you know, it's that's why I believe that people are so fed up with that and I hope that they will have an opportunity to express their frustration and the first one will be for you in Alberta with that referendum. So I want to talk a little bit about that because you just brought up a really good point about um really that 250 you know billion million dollars is really going to the US to buy ammunitions which is then going and yet somehow Mr. Trump and Mr. Carney are not supposed to be on each other's uh you know playbook here. um and and Carney is going to, you know, ring in all these tariffs and yet, you know, he gets elected and what does Brookfield do?

[00:24:22]Brookfield obviously had such amazing confidence in the Canadian economy, it decided to move its headquarters to the United States.

[00:24:31]>> Yeah, absolutely. And Carney is saying, you know, we cannot do business with the US anymore. We need to try to find other markets like in Europe and sign other free trade agreements. But what he forget is our natural you know relationship it's south. It's you know north and south and 70 75% of our commerce is with the United States. So we need to have a good deal with Trump to for our prosperity for the future of our country. Yes. You know, I agree that, you know, we can sign other free trade agreements, but actually Pierre Trudeau tried that in the 1970s and he called that the third voice, the third the and tried to tried to sign more free trade agreements with other countries and actually Arper did it also. But the fact is 75% of our trade relations is with the US. So we need to have a good free trade agreement and I I don't know Trump is sorry Carney is speaking like you know oh maybe I won't be able to have a deal so let's move uh and try to find other partners but we need to have that deal and he's not putting everything on the table for having that deal and I'm just say about supply management the cartel in milk dairy poultry and eggs it must be on the table that would be easier for our country to have a good deal. But for the conservatives and the liberals, there's no questions to put that they're working with the cartel and not with Canadians consumers.

[00:26:14]>> Yeah, they seem to certainly be putting certain special interests ahead of the interests of the Canadian populace for sure. On that note too though, um because we do Canada does do about 76% of its trade with the United States.

[00:26:29]They are our trading partner. And Carney is speaking like this is the end, like the absolute end. And yet Trump is temporary. He will be gone in a couple years. And yet the the conversations that seem to be had at the moment seem to be very permanent. And how do you think that the United States is viewing Carney's decision to align with China? I mean, it's one thing to align with the EU, which I do not support either. Um, but he seems to be positioning Canada as the next EU, next country to join the EU. Yet, here we have the United States right next door.

[00:27:10]But China of all places and and and for so people know, Canada does about 3% of its trade with China. China is an export country, not an import country.

[00:27:22]>> Yeah. Yeah. No, you're right about that.

[00:27:24]And uh you know the only deal that we can do with China that would be good for us. You know if we can sell them them some energy oil and gas but actually we didn't have any pipeline. We're not able to do that and you know that would be a nice a nice way to have a better price for our oil and gas but we cannot do that because the last 10 years we didn't build any pipelines. So yeah, when is uh allying with China, that's not good.

[00:27:54]When you are in the middle of a discussion for a free trade agreement with the US, um you know, it's uh what Trump is doing, it's like it it for him it's not important anymore and let's move on. But no, you're right, Nadine.

[00:28:10]When that relationship Trump is there and in two years, he won't be there anymore. They will have a new election and things will change. So, we must continue to build with the US and not try to turn the page and say, you know, forget it. I'll go with China. I prefer to be with the US.

[00:28:30]>> But we our values align so well apparently with China according to Mark Carney.

[00:28:36]>> Yeah. Yeah. That's crazy. I remember when he said that actually >> the new world order.

[00:28:42]>> Yeah. Yeah. everything if you know is Carney is a real globalist and he's showing us every day right now you know traveling across the world shaking hands try to have new deals putting new you know agency and you know he's a bureaucrat so he knows better than you and me what it's good for Canadians and Canadian economy so he's building all these new agencies and put money there and try to tell the free market what is good, what is not. And that's that's a solution that won't be successful.

[00:29:23]>> So his values align better with China despite >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, no.

[00:29:30]It's Yeah. A big bureaucrat globalist, you know, and try to tell us what we can do or what we cannot do.

[00:29:39]Look at what he's doing with just a free speech. All these bills try to control us on social media. I will agree with you. It's like China.

[00:29:53]>> Absolutely. And so with that in mind, um because Carney is, you know, he wrote it all down in his book. You know, it it seems like nobody did any homework, any research on Carney. He came in brand new after Trudeau. Um even though he had been advising Trudeau for many, many years. Um, and there is certainly a big divide right now between east and west.

[00:30:16]The country does seem to be falling apart. Can Canada even be fixed anymore, Max? I mean, I know you have a federal party and you're running at a federal level. And I know every Canadian, Albertans included, would love to be able to say that, you know what, we can remain Canadian and and and fix it. But I don't I is it possible?

[00:30:37]But that's why Naden I said at the last campaign we are the last hope for this country. If our policies are not adopted if the federal government is not you know putting our policies in law I don't see a bright future for this country and that's why also on our platform on federalism uh I said you know the federal government must stop to interfere in provincial jurisdictions.

[00:31:02]we must go back at our deal that we had in 1867.

[00:31:07]But that's not the case right now. So we decided to support the independentist movement in Quebec and in Alberta because it's not because I want to destroy the country. It's because it's the only way for Albertan or Quebecers to send a strong message to Ottawa.

[00:31:28]Enough is enough. And yes, we need to have that constitutional crisis to try to save this country. And if it's not working, you know, people in Alberta will have three choices if they vote yes. The first one, a new deal with Canada based on the constitution that we that that is the the basic of this country, the 1867 constitution with more autonomy. You know the federal government must not interfere in provincial jurisdictions in el care, dental care, daycare and try to stop u Alberta to develop their own natural resources that that was not part of the constitution. So they can have a new deal or they can be an independent country or they can be the 51st state.

[00:32:17]So all your doors are open if you vote yes. And same thing in Quebec also, Nadine, we have the PQ right now in Quebec with this young this young charismatic leader Paul St. Pierre Plamondo and the PQ the independentist party in Quebec is ahead in the polls right now. If there's an election tomorrow, the PQ will win a majority. Our election in Quebec will be in October at the same time as your referendum on the secession. And so I believe that maybe the PQ will be elected and the leader of the PQ is not afraid to say a vote for the PQ, it's a vote for the independence because I will have we will have another referendum in in my mandate. So if the PQ is elected in the next four years, you may have another referendum on the secession. And what's happening in Alberta, it's just the conclusion of all that frustration, not for the last 10 years or 20 years, the last 50 61 years. Because, you know, I'm I'm thinking about the equalization formula, the the money that you're giving to other provinces with that equalization formula that it's unfair.

[00:33:38]for the last 61 years you spend money to and you are you are paying for other provinces and you never receive any penny from that and you voted uh 62% I think three years ago or four years ago to change that equalization formula to have a new formula that would be safe to abolish that and the federal government say forget it you know like in Quebec in the referendum in 1995 Five, you had all these federalists that were coming to Quebec. Yeah. Yeah. We'll respect Quebec autonomy. We won't interfere anymore.

[00:34:16]And 30 years later, it's worse than it was. So during your electoral your referendum campaign, you will have Polv, you will have Carne, you will have Daniel Smith that will tell you, you know, don't vote yes. if you vote yes, you know, that will destroy the country and we won't be able to survive as a province. They will they will use fear like they did in Quebec at the first two referendum. But I believe that Albertan will look at it and for the first time in the history, you'll have the the the American government that will say, you know, I'm for Alberta separation.

[00:34:59]Remember, you know, in our referendum in 1995 in Quebec, you had the the American government that was for a United Canada and they were telling Quebecers, if you vote yes, you won't have a free trade agreement with the US and Quebecers voted yes at 49%. Now, you'll have them telling, you know, if you vote yes, yes, we can have a deal with you economically. And so, that would be very different. Uh, and I will be, you know, if I have a if I have some invitations, I will be there and and tell that to Albertans. A vote a yes, it's no risk.

[00:35:38]It's a vote for you. You have everything and you give all the the bargaining power to Daniel Smith. But if you vote no, you won't have any bargaining power.

[00:35:48]Look, just take that example. Quebecers voted at 49% for a change and 49% and you know nothing happened. It's worse 30 years later we have these daycare program pharmarmacare program all in provincial jurisdictions. You have the federal government that is spending billion of dollars that money that we don't have.

[00:36:16]So it's it's crazy but it's worse. So take that example. A no will go you will you will go you will go nowhere with a no. But with a yes you have all these opportunities.

[00:36:30]I I think Max that's been the message I've really been trying to push upon Albertans is that you can remain in the status quo and nothing is going to change. So we need something to change.

[00:36:44]Even if Canada is going to change in any way, shape, or form, we need something disruptive like this. And I I do honestly believe that Albertans, it puts Albertans in the driver's seat. Should they vote yes? But if we vote no, like just help my listeners understand so that people understand that if we lose this referendum, if people choose to vote no, what are the consequences not only for Canada, but what are the consequences for Albertans? I think it's one of the the biggest missed opportunities like of of a millennia.

[00:37:21]>> Oh yeah, absolutely. You know, if you have a no at 51% uh forget the development development of your natural resources, the federal government will be out there and say, "Okay, I did manage that." Like in Quebec, there's no problem. So they won't solve all your your frustration that you have and that would be business as usual or that would be worse. Uh like in Quebec it ask yourself why you have the PQ that it's back right now speaking about independence secession and still you know being very high in the polls.

[00:38:00]It's because Quebecers like Albertan are fed up with that. You can say, you know, oh, if Quebec is independent, they won't be able to receive $16 billion dollar from the equalization. Yes, but Quebecers don't know that we are a poor province because for them, we're not poor. And so, you know, that changing that formula will help Quebec to develop their own natural resources because we have a moratorum in Quebec on sh on natural gas. So we cannot exploit that and there's a lot of natural gas in Quebec. So so if you know we change that formula, we abolish that we we are less generous with that formula that will give the right incentives to provinces like Quebec and New Brunswick to develop like Alberta their own natural resources. But if you vote no, nothing will happen. the federal government will do business as usual and they will impose their their will to Albertans like like they're doing right now. So there's no there's no there's no hope if you vote for a no. So that's why you know I believe that if Albertan vote yes that we may have a future for this country but if Alberta vote Alberta Albertans vote no uh I don't know any any changes and if we don't have any changes that will be very tough for Canadians to to survive in that economic environment.

[00:39:37]So so many people here in Alberta are hanging on to this illusion, this belief that if we can just change the government, if only Paulv have gotten in. Now I don't disagree that maybe you would have seen some improvement, things would have slowed down um as far as the pace of which the direction we're going, but it's still the same direction. Am I wrong in in saying that, Max? Like what would have changed had a pure polyv government been elected?

[00:40:04]you know, Polyv would have been a good driver in the same car and going in the same direction and not at as fast as Carne. So, but we need to change direction and that's not happening right now. So that's why for us, you know, the people's party, I I'm looking at the future and I believe that we can have a bright future because, you know, we have the right policies to fix all that and more and more Canadians understand that, you know, if you do a poll on immigration or or the uh the policy to um to change the equalization formula, we have a lot of support on a lot of our policies individually, But people don't know that we exist and that we are there. So we need to work hard the next three years to be to be there. And I'm looking at what's happening with populist party in Europe, Marin Leen in France, in Germany, in in UK you have the reform party and you have the new party uh the reform and um what is the name of the new party? um reform I don't for I forget the other name but uh yeah so the these populist political parties in Europe are growing very fast our time will come but if our policies are not adopted I don't see a great bright future for Canada but now Max it's really funny I picked up a book actually yesterday in the airport called Chain of Ideas and this book actually talks about people like yourself uh Pierre Polyv the convoy freedom uh freedom convoy and it doesn't talk about it in a good light.

[00:41:51]It actually talks about it like we're the problem and so much of the world actually still believes you know that the freedom convoy was a problem that that this populist movement is somehow fringe and that our ideas and and you know we're not progressing we're not keeping up with the times. What do you say to that?

[00:42:14]Look at the history. You know, we were able to be a very successful country because of western civilization values, because of free markets, because of individual freedom. And you know, a lot of people wanted and still want to come to Canada. Why? Because Canada was open.

[00:42:33]That was a a land of opportunities. And that's not the case anymore. We just we spoke about that in the beginning. people are Canadians are leaving the country because there's no opportunities right now. So who's right? Who's who's not right? I believe that we are right because you know you look at the data and all the these woke policies or progressive policies or leftist policies are not are not helping the country are not helping Canadians. So we are right.

[00:43:05]Our time will come. And uh but the fact is all these leftists are now you know in universities. They are in parliaments. They are in big businesses.

[00:43:17]And you know we need a we need a revolution. We need a peaceful revolution to change that. And maybe that revolution can start in Alberta this October. I want to talk about leadership for a moment because so many people right now in Alberta are saying that we need um you know a leader an official a formal leader. I kind of like the committee idea you know select some spokespeople who can but we need a united message. This is the thing that I'm struggling with. We have some groups that, and I'm going to use the indigenous um treaties for example, who are like, "Oh, no. We're going to honor all the treaties. We're going to do this." This is a problem. I I believe because I believe we need one rule of law that applies to everybody equally.

[00:44:06]Otherwise, we're setting ourselves out on the same trajectory that Canada went arry on. And so, I mean, because justice should be blind, right? It shouldn't be, oh, well, there's cultural differences.

[00:44:16]Is are you Albertan? Yes or no? because if you are, this applies to you, >> right? And if you're going to move here, you're going to live here, well then this applies to you. Um, so on the leadership front, because Daniel Smith has made it very clear, she is not a separatist. She does not support separation. Um, and she's made it very clear on a number of different fronts.

[00:44:36]So what do we do here in Alberta on the leadership side? What what what do we need? What's needed here to make this a successful referendum?

[00:44:46]But I believe you know with the first nation what they're doing they try to stop that movement and I you know I'm waiting you're supposed to have a decision from the court in couple of days or weeks uh and if the decision is not in your favor uh you know that will that that will that will be very very um dangerous for for um for them because because you know It's it's the the engineers people cannot stop a movement.

[00:45:20]And what they have to realize is when with when we'll have that referendum and after that you'll have a government that will listen to the people and if it's a yes they will be at the table like the federal government and the new government after a yes will be able to have a decision a discussion with first nations and that will be it. You know, we did that in Quebec. The Quebec government signed, you know, an agreement with the First Nation couple of years ago. But remember what they did, the First Nation. They went to New York uh and they were the first referendum. They were all in New York and saying, you know, Quebec cannot be independent. You cannot have that referendum. We had that referendum two times and so they cannot stop you. And I hope that the court will realize that and have a good decision based on law and and if it's that after that after yes, you'll you'll sit down with the First Nation and the federal government and you'll be able to have a good future with them or without them.

[00:46:27]>> And would you agree though, Max, that it's a blank sheet of paper? I mean the way that the the the decision was rate written after the Quebec uh referendum really was that you know at that stage it becomes political not judicial. So we we start from a blank sheet of paper. We can create the country that we want.

[00:46:47]>> Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's that's the result of a referendum on a secession. You know you you won't be the first one. Look what happened in Europe.

[00:46:59]uh uh Czechoslovaki and all these country were created after a referendum uh that's and in Spain they have that discussion also so it happened in other countries and it will happen in the future it's normal that you know people living you know in a province or under an authority a government that they control it's normal that they want to control everything and they don't want the federal government or another external government to tell them what to do. So yeah, you know, that will be a a white sheet of paper and you'll start a new a fresh and you'll be able to decide and usually you know after a discussion about the new country sometime you have another referendum for the pe the population to approve that new relationship with Ottawa with us or with the first nation. So that's only the beginning of you know a great um a a great new direction for Alberta that would be better than you know the stat go. So, one of the things I want to talk about here because of course so many people are afraid. You just pointed out number of countries have separated and and some of the excuses I hear why we should stay. You know, we're landlocked.

[00:48:19]Um, you know, currencies, borders, pensions, all of these things are so fixable. Like, I don't even worry about those things because yeah, they do take time. They do take effort. Are they serious? Of course. But there's other countries that have done this. It's like to think that Alberta couldn't do it when Czechoslovakia and all these other countries around the world have done this many many times. Uh I think is just so such a ridiculous excuse to stay because it's hard. Okay.

[00:48:45]>> Yeah.

[00:48:46]>> Yeah. That that's really what they're saying. Oh, this is going to be hard.

[00:48:48]It's like of course it's going to be hard, but is it worth it? Of course. But one of the things I want to talk about because there's a lot of fear here and and I want I I mean I know you know that as a chartered investment manager, you've been in banking, you're also a lawyer. Let me let's talk about the Canada Pension Plan for a moment because we have so many people in Alberta, baby boomers, who are just afraid they're going to lose their pension. And I have done a tour of Alberta. For one, the pension is not what people believe it to be. It's a payroll tax in my opinion.

[00:49:19]It's a Ponzi scheme. um the people who you know signed up to it originally paid 2% you know today you're paying you know excess of 14% and that's only going to get worse but to the people who see all the negative and and and of course the other side is just going to push fear anything they can do to drive the fear and of course the Canada pension plan seems to be one of those to those people who are hanging on to that for dear life thinking that oh my goodness I can't vote for independence because I might lose my pension what would you Hey, >> they will have their pension. That would be the Albertton pension plan. We have that in Quebec. Actually, you know, we built in Quebec couple of years ago in the 1960s that Kais the depot and the Kais the depot, you know, they're the federal the provincial government in Quebec is taxing Quebecers and a part of that money is going to the case KEO and they're managing that and you know that's why we are able to have our own pension fund here in Quebec. You can have that in Alberta. You can have that in New Finland. You can have that in every province. The discussion will be about the money. How much the federal government will give you or not. And after that, you know, you'd be more prosperous.

[00:50:35]Alberta would be more prosperous. You'll be richer. You'll be able to pay for, you know, your people. And yes, you'll have the same kind of program because you'll take the good decision to develop your own economy. Right now, you cannot.

[00:50:50]So, I I don't see any problem that. They will speak about also, oh, you cannot use the Canadian dollars. Yeah. But anyway, there's other country like Puerto Rico, they're using the US dollar. The situation for you right now with the American being ready to help you to be independent, it's a it's huge.

[00:51:12]We didn't have that in Quebec at our first referendum and second referendum.

[00:51:16]The US government was in line with the federal government. Now you know you can have your build your own money, you can use the Canadian dollars or you can use the US dollars. All that will be a discussion that we will have and you'll decide what is the best option for you.

[00:51:33]>> Yeah. And I believe Alberta would make more sense to align with the US dollar.

[00:51:36]We do the majority of our business with the United States, not the rest of Canada. So I think, you know, being an oil and gas producer and exporter, I think that's where it would make the most sense. But again, a decision that can be made. I want to talk um just be quickly before we go because I I don't want to hog all your time although I would hog all your your time. So good to see you again, Max. Like we we just we need to do this more often.

[00:52:00]>> We will we will need >> we will. We will. And maybe we'll we'll have to do another tour. We'll maybe get Bruce involved and a few other people and we'll do a little tour around Alberta again.

[00:52:11]>> Flipping the script. So I want to talk about a concept that uh Professor Party has brought up a number of times and I love the way that he presents it. I totally agree with it. It's I've often spoken to it, but he puts it so eloquently when he talks about flipping the script because right now we have a government which we have to ask permission of to do everything. Max, I I honestly feel like I I'm I'd like to go to the bathroom at, you know, 203. Is that okay with you? You that's how constrained and and and I mean I'm an entrepreneur. I'm sitting here and I'm going I really don't want to start a new business in Canada. Why? because I'm being told what to do, when to do, how to do every moment of of the day. You know, how many breaths am I allowed to take? You know, because if you exhale too much carbon dioxide, I might be the one that gets, >> you know, I'm the climate change problem. So, you know, when he talks about >> they will capture you. They will capture you and put you aside, >> put me in the ground. That's the plan. I got it. All right.

[00:53:10]Not a pretty picture here. Um but he talks about flipping the script. So in in his idea of a constitution for Alberta, his idea is that we would adopt uh the people would have all of their rights. I mean to me this is freedom.

[00:53:27]You're born with these rights. You were born free. And if that is indeed the case, then the government has no rights except for those that we grant it, which is the complete opposite, it seems, of what we have today. How does that functionally work?

[00:53:47]>> But the the question first of all what you will do you will have a sheet of paper white nothing there and you will write your own constitution and I know that Bruce Patty is helping you and working on that and I've read what he did. It's very great. So you're gonna you're gonna write your own constitution and after that you will be able to present that to your people and say this is the new Alberta. Do you agree? Yes or no? So the you know the fact that the federal government won't be there uh to to interfere in your own provincial affairs or own autonomy that's a plus. But how you will change everything for me you know if you the change would be for more freedom. Look at all these legislations that the federal government is putting forward now Carney has a majority. So the freedom on social media the free speech the police can come at your house because you said something on social media. All that will be gone. So you will start and and vote your own legislation on every subject. So it's you can do it. Every country did it before. And actually we still have a discussion here in in Quebec. As you know the the the Quebec government presented a bill that a new constitution for Quebec. Did this this bill didn't pass because we'll be in election this fall. But we have the discussion in Quebec about our own jurisdictions, what we must do, what we are able to do, what we want to do. And if Quebec is an independent country, what we will do, you know, we will keep our pension fund, we will maybe keep the Canadian dollars, um there's a lot of thing that you can do, but everything is open. So yeah, you you need to have that discussion between yourself and uh it's happening right now during that campaign that started I believe couple of weeks ago because now you have the the right number with your signatures so it has to be approved but the campaign will be very short. You'll have couple of months and you need to be out there. You need to promote you and I agree with you. You need to have a unified message for the population.

[00:56:14]>> Yeah. And it seems there that there's there's people within that just the inconsistencies are a little bit challenging because it confuses people.

[00:56:22]I think we just need to remove the confusion. Um Max, any last words? I know I promise to keep this to under an hour. So any last words for Albertans and of course let us know like you have everything I have done politically. You have been my inspiration and and I don't hide that fact from people. You really have though because you have been so principled um in the policies that you've put forward. They've never changed. We've added some, but you you've never changed them and you've had integrity with me. Um you've always done what you said you were going to do. And that's just something you don't see in politics. You know, I I I I keep telling people it's the most immoral, unethical, corrupt industry I've ever worked in in all of my life with very few exceptions.

[00:57:05]You're laughing because you know it's true. Um, >> yeah, I know it's true, >> right?

[00:57:10]>> That's why that's why, you know, I decided to create the people's party after 13 years uh with all that, you know, saying something to people and the other day on other things and being elected on on a big promise and you don't do it. So, I said, "No, I'm fed up with that. We have principle and with these principles we'll have policies and we are offering a new party to Canadians and you know the people's party will be there when Canadians are ready.

[00:57:41]>> Yeah. And so where would people find more information about the the policies and the principles because you know we we ran on freedom, fairness, respect and responsibility and it's like it is the foundation.

[00:57:53]>> Yeah. Yeah, it is. Yeah, it is. And you know, I'm proud that we had good candidates like you all across the country and we are fighting because you know it's it's it's a kind of a revolution voting for the people's party and you were there promoting our ideas, promoting the principle, the philosophy, the the values, individual freedom, personal responsibility, fairness and respect. And it's all the same right now after eight years. And so people if they want to know more, they can go on our website people's partyofcanada.ca CA.

[00:58:25]They can also follow me on X, Twitter, Maxim Bernier and all these YouTube channel you know be go on our website and just you know be a member or register for our newsletter. So we are sending every week a new newsletters based on what's happening in this country. So you know we we are doing politics differently because like you said there's a lot of corruption in politics but for us you know we are telling the truth based on facts and maybe the truth may not be popular today sorry but we believe that the more we speak about it the more popular it would become and that's the way we are doing politics and you just have to do the same thing with that referendum telling the truth to Albertans No fear. This is what will happen. We will be 100% in control. Not a tawa, not another country. And that's, you know, that's a big challenge, but also it's a great opportunity. It's, it will be an historical opportunity, and I hope you won't miss it. And if I can help, if I can uh speak about why I'm supporting the independence as a federalist because I'm seeing right now there's no hope with these politicians and you need to shake the tree. You need to have that constitutional crisis to try to have something new and if not you'll have to be independent.

[00:59:55]>> Wonderful. I I love it. So I I keep telling people, you know, you are were my inspiration for a lot of the ideas and the fact that things could change and the momentum that, you know, you've built over the years and, you know, in Alberta, you know, we will be our own country. So, you know, sadly you won't be our prime minister, but um great ideas. This is a battle of ideas. So, thank you, Max, so much for being with me today. I so appreciate it. And, uh, I will be in touch. We'll we'll have to actually maybe do another little road show here amongst Albertans and get you out in front of more people because it's so nice to hear it from a different perspective and somebody who's looking from the outside in. Sometimes when you're in the weeds, you don't always see the the other issues.

[01:00:41]>> I'm ready to that I'm ready for that, Nadine. So, let's stay in touch. Thank you very much. And um yeah uh I wish you big success and my my main message to Albertans right now is be part of the change, be the change, be courageous, vote for what you believe and you know right now that the system is not working for you. So just vote in line with that and after that everything will come. No fear. be confident in the future and in yourself and you know you'll have a bright future not only for yourself but for your kids and your grandkids and I know that's why you're doing that and you're doing the right thing.

[01:01:23]>> So there you have it everybody Maxim Bernier no fear be the change you wish to see in the world as Mahatma Gandhi put it and um you know it is such a tremendous opportunity that Albertans are being presented with right now and the status quo is not acceptable. I think the majority of Albertans know the status quo is not acceptable and you've heard it from somebody who's been in politics, somebody's from the outside looking in at what the opportunity is.

[01:01:48]Nobody wants to see, you know, Canada, the country broken apart. But what we see here is that there's no future in the trajectory, the direction which Canada is going. So we need to shake the tree. We need that vote for independence, that yes on the referendum in October. Why? because that is what gives us the opportunity to a if we want to reform it great at least now we have an audience we're invited to the table if we want other options whether it be the 51st state we want full independence which is obviously my audience knows that's the way I feel we should go then that's what we should do but you have to get involved if you liked this video which I'm sure you do please do like please do share it amongst your friends your family get it out there we need more people to get involved in the conversation give us your comments. Tell us what you like. Tell us what you didn't like. Send us your questions.