Khumalo & Mkhwanazi targeted in arrest plot?

[00:00:00]General Kumalo and possibly even Muanazi threatened with arrest or not? What's going on? Plus, Sona appears at the Mlanga Commission. Why is it important?

[00:00:14]Let's find out.

[00:00:17]>> Fam, this year Pace Car Rental turns 20.

[00:00:20]And trust me, they've earned this milestone. If you need a reliable car rental company with great service, check out Pace and keep an eye on their website and social media because they've got some interesting and exciting birthday surprises in store. Pace Car Rental, 20 years on the road. I hear you.

[00:00:42]>> Spread the fire. Welcome back to SMWX, fam. Don't forget to hit that like button and get us to half a million subscribers. Goodness me, a lot going on in the republic. Today, I want to start off by looking at the mysterious case of the arrest that wasn't an arrest of General Dumisani Kumalo and another official from crime intelligence where none other than General Muanazi pitched up at the scene. And just when we thought a possible explosive arrest was about to take place, it all collapsed. a lot of confusion, a lot of mayhem, a lot of incoherence in our criminal justice system over the last few days. We'll then also get on to events at the Mazlanga Commission today where General Sona appeared. Now, let us begin with the arrest that wasn't an arrest. This is an interesting one to try and figure out. So, let's try and get the facts straight on this and Ora will help me out here. So yesterday we suddenly hear that General Muanazi is is he is it in Ptoria?

[00:01:50]>> Yeah. Brooklyn police station.

[00:01:51]>> At the Brooklyn police station in and around a possible arrest of crime intelligence boss General Dumisani Kumalo. It later emerges that it's not just about Kumalo, it's also about uh the head of crime intelligence gathering Noipo Madondo. Now these two are effectively two senior figures at the top of South Africa's crime intelligence infrastructure and what we heard and what has emerged through various different news reports today is that Kumalo received a call from an official at crime intelligence that's all we know we don't know exactly which official to say that he and McDondo should present themselves at a police station they duly began going to the police station and then Muanazi is an interesting person who figures here because he wasn't told uh anything about uh a potential arrest but Muanazi separately says that he has received intelligence that the operation around Kumalo also affects him. So he it appears preemptively also went to effectively say well it looks like you're looking for me so so I'm here. That's the most move I've ever heard. like I heard you wanted to arrest me so here I am before even uh being asked to be there but his presence of course changed the entire shape of this picture because Kumalo is actually already before court on another matter. He and Quanazi are clearly allies. But by Muanazi going there and being there at the scene preemptively, I mean the entire nation woke up and and was shocked to see that Muanazi himself could be uh part of this broader problem. Now, IDAC of course is already behind the rest, the first arrest and in fact the criminal trial of Dumisani Kumalo in a matter that Muanazi has spoken about a lot which relates to the appointment of um an official within crime intelligence uh which who is apparently or who is alleged not to have had the appropriate qualifications.

[00:03:58]This arrest is around similar issues.

[00:04:01]The suggestion is that Madoro does not have the appropriate security vetting and apparently it's a it was going to be a fraud arrest around um effectively knowingly presenting information that was false around the lack of vetting of Madoro.

[00:04:18]But the arrest didn't happen.

[00:04:22]You've you've got to love this country.

[00:04:24]An arrest that's not an arrest. We then heard from IDAC that there was no arrest in sight or any thoughts or comments up to this point of the story and then I'm going to get the IDAC statement up.

[00:04:37]>> No, it's it's I think it it turned into a big mess and I think >> um shout out to CA and Bullet Jones and Aba Ramji who who broke the story.

[00:04:47]>> Great. But I think the the story there is also allegedly that this has also got to do with a multi-million rand property and we heard this obviously from testimony at the ADOC committee and is also part of how Fidil Adams and Dan Kabard were also you know >> in in not involved but came to the picture in terms of the story line. Um but it's yeah it's a mess.

[00:05:13]>> Yeah absolutely absolutely. So, let's see what IDAC then said. Um, press release 18th of June. We'll bring it up for you. IDAC dispels reports on the arrest of crime intelligence head.

[00:05:29]The NPA's investigative investigating directorate against corruption, that's IDA, takes note of media reports on the arrest of the head of crime intelligence, General Dumisanu Kumalo.

[00:05:41]We wish to set the record straight that General Kumalo has not been arrested.

[00:05:45]nor has anyone else from Crime Intelligence. End of statement. It's not every day that one branch of law enforcement issues a statement saying that another head of another branch of law enforcement has not been arrested.

[00:06:00]But this is where we are now. This has led to of course grave public confusion, speculation and we had an interesting article today from News24 journalist Karen Mour which I think sheds some light. you know, we don't know the facts and it's hard in the words of Justice Nobore to excavate beneath all the speculation, but I think this report is worth noting and and what Karen Mour suggests is that there was an attempt to arrest Kumalo and the arrest stalled based on the instability that is already brewing in the country around the so-called 30th of June. deadline around anti-immigrant marches.

[00:06:51]So, I mean that that in itself is is is just crazy. What it means is that one IDA wanted to arrest Kumaro, but because Kumaro is already involved in the criminal justice system's efforts to stem the tide on the 30th of June, they will arrest him later. How can the South African government effectively be saying, "We think we'll arrest you, but first deal with the other crisis and then we'll we'll arrest you later." So, we now have a >> Sorry, >> I don't buy it.

[00:07:22]>> Yeah.

[00:07:22]>> Because this this political instability around the 30th of June didn't all of a sudden exist after they told them to prepare overnight bags [clears throat] and come to the police station. Um I think for a couple of months now and weeks we've known about this supposed looming 30 June deadline regarding illegal immigration.

[00:07:42]>> Um why did they tell them to come to the police or tell Kumalo at least to come to the police station in the first place and what changed >> in the supposed political instability in those couple of hours and they decided no we're not >> true >> we're not arresting anymore. I think it's a front. I think they got cold feet. They probably also didn't expect Mkanazi to arrive there on the same day as well, >> and they didn't know how they'd possibly handle what what seems to be something that was out of out of their control.

[00:08:09]Well, we've got some very interesting comments from Muanazi on the day and I think let's let's go there because Muanazi is reported to have said that this arrest is part of a broader and a larger war and that is really concerning given how delicate our criminal justice system already is on the back of the Madanga Commission, the original Muanazi allegations.

[00:08:35]One would hope that the country would be in a more stable position now. But if any if this is anything to go by, then we may have a period of instability ahead. Let's take a look at what Mkanazi himself said.

[00:08:47]>> Well, we don't know. It's but it it's it's got resemblance of some typical strategies that have been employed, but um we're still going to dig deep in it.

[00:08:58]>> My understanding is that not only has there been a warrant of arrest prepared for the crime intelligence boss, but for yourself as well. Are you aware of this?

[00:09:07]No. Well, what the intelligence received yesterday was that um they they they've given themselves 48 hours to make sure that myself and Kumalo are beyond bus because they believe that we have secured warrant of arrest for ADC officials which was I did not believe that story that there's something like that because there's no warrant of arrest um and from where I am there's not even an investigation that involves anyone from my deck. So why would you come to war of arrest and and a person who makes up a story I thought it's just a story that is flying but when Kumalo told me today that he's receive a phone call by IDC that say he must present himself at the station so I thought the 48 hours that we were warned about yesterday it's it's it's real that's why I came here so that first I can confirm what Kumar to see the phone numbers that called him and also if IDA is here I might as well say here I am if you need me as well but to my surprise is then Kumar gets another phone call that says that he doesn't have to present himself because of some executive decision.

[00:10:14]>> In fact, that's also what we've been told. Have you gotten any clarity as to what exactly happened between the time Kumalo was told to present himself and the time at which he then was not going to be processed at this police station.

[00:10:29]>> There are phone numbers that called them. the people that own those phone numbers perhaps are the one they must take the microphone and tell South Africa why did they call them to come here and why did they call him not to come here >> so that's some context as to what Mkanazi felt was happening on the day let's take a look at him reflecting on the battle in the criminal justice system >> while we presented before border commission at our committee that if nothing drastic is done there's going to be blood on the street and I do hope that our executive authorities are going to do something big about this. It cannot be left like this. If we as security cluster, the people who are charged with the responsibility of protecting citizens, we are playing with their lives, then government must remove all of us and start a fresh. That means we don't we don't deserve to be here because we are busy playing games and that that's what that's not what it's supposed to be. We supposed to be here and executing our task. Us as colleagues must be able to talk to each other and get along. But it's clear that we are not getting along and it's clear that um there's there's fight amongst us and if that fight we should we bring to the attention of our leaders and if there's no intervention on that side I'm afraid but there's some something big might might happen in this country. So I think another aspect is we also heard from um reports that the reason why IDC wanted to arrest and the intelligence that Iazi and Kumalo got that they'd be arrested within 48 hours was that IDAC and Johnson and of course these are still allegations at this point had thought that Muanazi and Kumalo were investigating a case where Andrea Johnson advocate Andrea Johnson who heads up ADAC was going to be arrested and I think that's that's why Konazi is also alluding to the fact that this is just another factional battle within the police happening.

[00:12:19]>> Yeah, that's a big point and an important one. So like a kind of preemptive strike.

[00:12:24]>> Yeah. And I and I think like he says there if if if nothing's done about the fact that I mean there can't be factions >> playing out like this um in the police.

[00:12:33]So I think this is a serious issue >> um and I think surely is something the national commissioner acting now >> and the police minister possibly even the president need to start start. Yeah, >> the acting national commission [laughter] and acting police minister >> police minister need to really we're nearly a year >> since 6th of July last year >> and yeah, these are these are issues that are very serious and I think need really urgent attention.

[00:12:59]>> Yeah, absolutely.

[00:13:00]>> We can't have a police officer saying there's going to be blood on the streets, guys, >> because of factional police battles.

[00:13:05]>> And when do they have time to protect citizens and do their duties?

[00:13:09]>> Indeed. Indeed. Well, we'll keep an eye on the story. Let me know your thoughts in the comments down below. Let's finish off at the Mazanga Commission today where the grandfather of SMW [laughter] was spotted representing one of one of the people at the commission.

[00:13:26]Let's look at what General Sona uh had to say today because let's situate General Sona's testimony and why it's important. It's actually important for a number of reasons. The main reason I would say around the Minanazi allegations is that it's alleged that Sona met Kat Madala in the presence of General Mkonazi. So that's one big one.

[00:13:45]Another big aspect of his testimony is remember that there were WhatsApp communic there was WhatsApp communication between Sona and Madala.

[00:13:53]Recall that that story about President Ramapora's ID numbers being sent between them.

[00:14:00]uh property transactions with with members of the Sona family. Um allegations to that effect. So there there's that raft of allegations. But now with this new drug bust evidence, various witnesses have suggested that Sona was the only person who had the keys to the warehouse where these drugs were stolen in Port Shepston. So today's testimony centered largely around that branch of the Mlanga Commission's probe.

[00:14:31]However, Sona himself made some uh complaints about the way that he is being brought in what he called a peacemeal way to the commission. In other words, rather than waiting for all the evidence to be weighed up against him and then him being given an opportunity to respond, he's kind of not sure of all the claims and allegations that are being made against him and he has to come in periodically and he would rather prefer not that he doesn't want to testify but to testify all at once at the end. Let's take a listen to what Zona said in relation to the Port Shepston drug bust. And you'll remember KL S of coffee machine fame uh Sona responded to his testimony today and let's take a look at what he said.

[00:15:20]>> I have no recollection of subjecting the member to a polygraphic test relating to the theft of a coffee machine. I should not have to answer this allegation in this statement. I do so out of caution and attach the im the im emails the mails from left general lea because of the very real prospects that these questions may be directed at me even though I have not received the requisite notices and additional uh documents from the commission commissioners. I want to add that on this paragraphs the placement of warrant officer Sanders the complaint it was very serious.

[00:16:07]I think the commission the commission has also this document which they they they provided to us later I think in the early hours of yesterday.

[00:16:18]They have this this complaint whereby there was a serious allegations of Warren Officer Sand and other members involved in the theft of cocaine at the harbor [clears throat] and selling it to a specific gang. I'm just worried to say names of other people that never came here because the last time I was caused to say certain names and I'm on litigation for your information commission. So clearly primaci sona has serious questions to answer especially about this drug bust. How did these drugs go missing? Why were the instructions given to store the drugs in this port shiftton warehouse? And as the custodian of the keys, did he have any role to play in the fact that these drugs were actually stolen? If he didn't have a direct role to play, then as the person exercising oversight over the hawks, why did he not know that such an operation was underway with police involvement? So, it's clear those are the questions he has to answer. Now, Sona also um made mention of the fact that he was suspended uh after his previous testimony earlier this year at gunpoint, which I found quite interesting. and he said he had to spend two weeks in hospital after that. Um the details are not exactly clear but again allegations and counter allegations of people within the criminal justice system acting overzealously in in this war within the criminal justice system.

[00:17:46]Yeah, I think he was given that explanation also to highlight the fact that he's been on two because Justice Madlanga asked him how long he's a he had thought he's disciplinary his suspension had lapsed and he was explaining the fact that no he's been on two separate suspensions >> first linking to the port sheps and drug um >> theft but also another interesting development that came during his testimony at the Madanga commission was that he was also since October last year undergoing a disciplinary process for the IM I think it's Ishmael Nangi uh case and that case people can go back to past episodes we've done included the the I think it's a Mosamb beacon national who was accused of kidnapping and the allegation there was that certain police officers including Sona and his team had allegedly tortured Nangi um so he's been acquitted of that >> of that of those charges through this disciplinary hearing but I'm still not convinced about this whole Portsin drug um bust and and and the theft of these drugs because for me there were too many red flags.

[00:18:51]The fact that the alarm system was not properly uh functional uh is a big one.

[00:18:55]And and there's another story about how there was a police officer who knew that at some point I don't know if it was during a visit to the premises or was at the office and realized that weirdly enough there were lights that were on at >> at the at on one of the floors in the building. Didn't quite check and patrol.

[00:19:13]So there's too many >> no something dodgy definitely.

[00:19:16]>> Yeah. There's too many weird things happening around around this drug bust.

[00:19:20]And I think he also alluded to >> the fact that look the reason why I believed Brigadier Nusa who said this was a safe place to store these drugs was cuz in 2018 there were Mandre drugs that were stored here and nothing had happened. He brought up an article which had a picture of Biggie Clele, former minister of police, Lieutenant General Konazi um in what he says was the Port Shepson story uh strong room which stored these Port Shepston drugs that we we talking about now. Um and that's why he thinks or he he supported the idea of storing these drugs in Port Shepston.

[00:19:55]>> Yeah, lots of questions to answer.

[00:19:57]>> Yeah, fam. I hope you have a great weekend.

[00:20:02]Thank you for watching SMWX. It's been great to be with you this week. There is so much happening in our country. Next week we come back more mazanga commission. Who knows what's going to be going on with this kumalo situation.

[00:20:18]Impeachment committee is sitting again and who knows what else. Hopefully Bafana Bafana bring us a win. We got a [clears throat] draw. We got a draw. We scored our first goal.

[00:20:27]>> So we have to win against South Korea.

[00:20:29]Maybe we will actually get a goal from open play against South Korea.

[00:20:32][laughter] That would be that would be good. We looked decent in the second half.

[00:20:37]>> We did. We did.

[00:20:38]>> We should have actually beaten beaten check >> if we if we bring that same energy.

[00:20:42]>> I think we'll give But South Korea is the most I think probably the most difficult team to beat in this group.

[00:20:47]>> It's going to be a tall order. And we always I know you were only born like [laughter] two World Cups ago.

[00:20:57]>> [gasps] >> Um, it's actually my 20 year reunion today. People from from uh high school decades.

[00:21:04]>> Yeah. I'm [laughter] actually going for a reunion uh with my friends from a trick 20 years ago.

[00:21:10]>> But um >> this is a 3:00 a.m. game as well. Yo, >> I know >> South Africans, if we could stay up and watch the polygamous and Jonasi through the mid through [laughter] the late night.

[00:21:19]>> I still haven't watched it.

[00:21:20]>> Please, let's let's let's wake up and support the boys at 3:00 a.m. next week Thursday. You haven't watched the Pygamus?

[00:21:25]>> No. No, I still haven't. Fam, let's toss CO in the comments. He has to watch this show.

[00:21:29]>> Hey man, says it's got more more drama than the Masanga Commission.

[00:21:34]>> No, it does. Maybe we'll do some Netflix analysis. Who knows? [laughter] >> Netflix must pay us first.

[00:21:39]>> Yeah, true, true.

[00:21:41]>> Now, um >> is also testifying next week at the >> Oh, yeah. Yeah, exactly.

[00:21:45]>> So, a lot to watch out for.

[00:21:46]>> Yeah, but what I was saying is we always have to wait for the last game in a World Cup. But will never give you that that grace to qualify in the first two.

[00:21:54]We've we've got to get all the acturies out.

[00:21:57]>> I'm telling you, gold difference and all kinds. [laughter] But let's do it. Let's do it. Um let's hope we win. Fam, great to see you. Thanks for rocking with us this week and we'll see you on the next one.

[00:22:10][music] You know, there [music] no [music] >> [music]