Former UK Home Secretary says Keir Starmer's resignation was 'inevitable' | 7.30

[00:00:01]The question my party is asking now is whether I am best placed to lead us into the next general election.

[00:00:12]I have heard the answer of my parliamentary party to that question.

[00:00:18]And I accept that answer with good grace.

[00:00:23]Every decision I've taken has been about putting the country I love first.

[00:00:29]That is why I will resign as leader of the Labour Party.

[00:00:35]I have spoken to His Majesty the King this morning to inform him of my decision.

[00:00:41]I will ask the National Executive Committee of the Labour Party to set out a timetable with nominations opening on the 9th of July and completed by the summer recess.

[00:00:53]In the case of a contest, this will ensure a new leader is in place before Parliament returns in September.

[00:01:01]I will remain in post as Prime Minister until the contest is complete.

[00:01:07]>> Sir Keir Starmer's resignation was triggered by the runaway success in a weekend by-election of his chief challenger and likely successor, the so-called King of the North.

[00:01:17]Andy Burnham, who's now headed to Westminster to be sworn in as MP for Makerfield, trounced the Reform Party candidate in the northern seat on Saturday, giving colleagues hope that Labour can still defeat the surging populist Reform Party at the next election.

[00:01:33]Andy Burnham was an MP from 2001 to 2017 and then became mayor of Manchester.

[00:01:39]If successful in his bid bid to become the next Prime Minister, he'll become Britain's seventh leader in a decade.

[00:01:46]A revolving door that's prompted the question, is the UK ungovernable?

[00:01:51]Alan Johnson was the UK Home Secretary under Gordon Brown and a long-time supporter of Sir Keir Starmer, who recently switched his allegiances to Andy Burnham. Alan Johnson, welcome to the program.

[00:02:04]>> Thank you. It's good to be here.

[00:02:06]>> Can I just get your reaction first of all to Sakia Starmer's speech?

[00:02:12]>> Yeah, I I mean, I didn't switch my allegiance to Andy Burnham. Like Sakia Starmer, I saw the reality of the situation was that the Prime Minister it was inevitable that Andy Burnham was going to challenge and it was inevitable that Andy Burnham was going to win. That Labour Party members would elect him over Sakia Starmer. My reaction is very sad. I mean, we saw Cameron resign after losing the referendum on on our membership of the European Union. We saw Boris Johnson resign. He was a disaster. We saw Liz Truss resign. She was a catastrophe. This is a guy who won less than 2 years ago the second biggest Labour Party victory in our history, huge majority of [snorts] 173.

[00:02:58]But in those 2 years something has happened. Sakia just cannot He's not a populist, but he's certainly not popular and the view was that he couldn't win uh another term and that was his view in the end as he's announced. So, he stepped down typically of Sakia in a decent dutiful manner putting the country before his party.

[00:03:23]>> Now, just before we come to Andy Burnham, just on the the technical uh what unfolds now, does Andy Burnham get a straight run to Downing Street or will there be a contest?

[00:03:37]>> Well, I hope it'll be a coronation as they call it. We don't know. Uh you have to get 81 Labour MPs to support you.

[00:03:45]Andy Burnham definitely has that and lots to spare.

[00:03:50]Uh it's doubtful if any other challenger will get that kind of support to stand.

[00:03:56]So, I think when you're in opposition, electing the leader can go on and on and you can have a big debate and all the rest. When you're in government and when you're standing to be the Prime Minister, the country can't afford that. We've got all kinds of problems, as you have in Australia, international problems, but also economic problems and problems uh, unique to Britain. So, you can't spend a long time having an internal debate about who's going to be the leader. So, I hope it's a coronation. We don't know yet. We'll know by July the 9th. And it's quite interesting that this will all be over before the summer recess, whereas some people were saying that Keir Starmer should set out a timetable to resign in September, just about when the Labour Party conference is. He's taken, I think, the wise decision that let's get this over with, the sooner the better.

[00:04:50]Uh, and it was quite an emotional moment cuz, as I say, this is a successful Prime Minister um, [snorts] stepping down.

[00:04:57]>> But nonetheless, you thought it was inevitable that Andy Burnham would come for his position. Tell us about Andy Burnham. Andy Burnham was an MP >> [sighs] >> before, um, in the time that you were in politics. He's been the mayor of a northern town. He talks a lot about how Westminster fails the north. What are Andy Burnham's qualities and what are his weaknesses as a potential Prime Minister?

[00:05:21]>> Well, I was a government minister with him, a cabinet minister with him. He was Chief Secretary to the to the Treasury.

[00:05:27]Uh, and he was also a cabinet minister in the Department for Culture and Sport, etc. What are his attributes? He's incredibly popular. He can relate to people. I think what Keir struggled with in a kind of environment where it's difficult, the television age, the internet age, social media. You have to connect in so many ways. Keir is a very shy, private man, and he found that bit of his job, rather as Gordon Brown did, by the way, going back uh 16 years. Um he found that very difficult. And he's got a kind of s- bit of stardust sprinkled over him.

[00:06:09]He relates to people. He's very popular in Manchester, in the north. He's the first, interestingly enough, the first leader of the Labour Party from the north since Harold Wilson way back in the '60s and early '70s. Um that kind of means something over here, but I can understand if your viewers in Australia are puzzled about exactly what's going on, because you have to be here to understand it. I'm puzzled.

[00:06:37]But basically, that by-election that was held uh in Makerfield, in the Manchester area, was meant to be a big victory for the right for reform.

[00:06:49]And what Burnham did was overturn all the uh sociologists' predictions.

[00:06:55]A- And win it, not just win it, but win it by a country mile. And in a sense, that became a little bit of a barometer for what he could do leading the Labour Party. He's very personable. He's a very natural guy. He's not a- away with the fairies on the left. He's a he's a moderate. Um and he's very good at getting things done. Has been in Manchester. Very different job being Prime Minister, but that has built his reputation.

[00:07:24]>> So, I mean, clearly, he's convinced the colleagues that he's got the chance to be a proper opponent to reform. What about other sections of the country?

[00:07:33]Will the City of London be cheering today, or will they be concerned about some of the things that Burnham said about the bond market in the UK having too much power about possibly taking assets back under national control. What will be the reaction in other parts of the community tonight?

[00:07:51]>> Well, he rode back a bit on that on the bond markets. I think this will be about who he appoints to his cabinet.

[00:07:59]The Chancellor at the moment, first ever woman to be Chancellor of the Exchequer in Britain, is a woman called Rachel Reeves. And the bond markets are quite keen to see Rachel stay there.

[00:08:11]I think Andy would be wise to keep Rachel Reeves there, not least of all cuz he's there's a budget coming up. You know, we're running He's going to be running the country. And the budget in the autumn is going to be a very important time.

[00:08:25]Rachel Reeves is obviously obviously prepared for it.

[00:08:29]If there's a change there, someone new coming in, I think the bond markets may worry about it. But basically, I think there'll be some stability because Andy Burnham is not some stranger who's walked in off the streets. He's got a long He came into Parliament 4 years after me, so in in 2001.

[00:08:49]So, he might look young, but he's been around a while. But he has got the ability, I think, to calm things down and to properly hand over from Keir Starmer's stewardship to to an Andy Burnham premiership.

[00:09:05]>> Just a quick question on the international scene, because obviously he's arriving at a moment of extreme turmoil. How do you think Andy Burnham would go with Donald Trump?

[00:09:17]>> Well, there's a good question. How would anyone get on with Donald Trump, who actually announced the Prime Minister's resignation over here, by the way, poking his nose into our politics once again? He probably had a private conversation with Starmer. And then revealed it to the world, typical of Donald Trump. Here's an interesting idea, though. Um, Keir Starmer's huge success has been on the international stage. He refused to follow Trump into his misadventure in the Middle East. Uh, and in on many fronts he's led a European response over Ukraine, for instance, even though we're not part of the European Union.

[00:09:57]Why not make Keir Starmer foreign secretary? It's a tip for Andy. Keep Rachel Keep Rachel Reeves where she is and make Keir Starmer foreign secretary.

[00:10:07]>> I thought you might say that. Alan Johnson, thank you very much indeed for joining us on this eventful night. Thank you.

[00:10:12]>> Thank you.